Dog Owner Who Sent In Mixed Dog Food Sample To Expertox Responds

The person who sent in the mixed sample of dog food to Expertox, which was found to have acetaminophen in the sample, emailed us this response:

I picked up the bags on July 4th from my dealer, who is 100 miles away. Several of us here feed Canidae and make one big order every couple of months, and the dealer either meets us about 35 miles away or we go there, depending on everyone’s schedules.

My friend kept bugging me to test the foods I feed to be sure they were safe because of all the troubles with other foods, so I finally did. I sent 2 samples to be tested: one was a composite of Canidae Lamb/Rice (manufactured June 6th) and the original All Life Stages (manufactured June 7). The other was a composite of California Natural adult lamb/rice and puppy lamb/rice.

Originally the lab, reading composite on the order, combined samples form both bags and ran a composite of all 4 foods. That came back showing acetaminophen. They realized that I had ordered two tests of two different composites, redid the tests, one of Canidae and the other of California Natural. The CA Natural came back fine; the Canidae showed acetaminophen.

I contacted my dealer first, and she wanted to contact her rep. I told her I’d wait until the next day to call the Canidae main office. She was leaving for dog shows and evidently didn’t get hold of her rep, because Canidae began getting calls and e-mails before I had a chance to call them. I’m in daily contact with Canidae, gave them permission to send part of my sample for further testing. We’re also discussing my sending them an unopened bag from the same batch for more testing. Wish everybody would leave them alone and give them some peace so we can work on this.

109 Responses to “Dog Owner Who Sent In Mixed Dog Food Sample To Expertox Responds”

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  1. Jenny Bark says:

    Pit Bull Lover, Ann Martins book is really good. I use it to get people off of pfi food. Get ready to do a lot of crying but now I know for shure you won’t use pfi food after reading it.

  2. llp says:

    Is anyone using Balance It Vitamins? This was recommended by the Nutritionist from Pet Diets.

  3. straybaby says:

    llp, i don’t know anything about the vitamins, but the vet that owns the site/vitamins consults with walmart and the pfi and was just hired by Natura. he is a nutritionist, but i would want to know the source of EVERYTHING in his blend. again, i know nothing about the vitamins, his background/education seems fine otherwise, but who he associates with is something i take into consideration these days. i also thought his site was expensive. much cheaper to buy a book!

  4. CarolPW says:

    llp

    When the pet food excrement hit the fan (for me on April 14th), I paid for the PetDiets.com cat and dog food recipes and bought their recommended supplement from Balance-It. They are probably excellent in terms of nutritional value, but they seem to be entirely synthetic (not derived from whole food sources). I couldn’t stand the smell, and my impression was that they gave the pet food a ‘chemical’ taste (yes, I taste the pet food I make).

  5. llp says:

    straybaby, thanks for the info. I paid PetDiets for a homecooked diet recommendation, they included the Balance It Supplement in their recommendations. I will e-mail them with more questions. I have all the books, paid a fortune for them, the bone meal made the dog sick, she kept losing weight. All started from cpf poisioning. I needed a specific diet which included all medical history from the vet.

  6. llp says:

    Carol, what are you using now? I am not happy about synthetic vitamins! I would like to know how to duplicate the recommendations with natural vitamin sources. Have you found any?

  7. Katie says:

    llp, I don’t use Balance It but talk to your vet. It is possible that you can substitute a baby vitamin or half of an adult vitamin - depending upon your dog’s weight.

    I agree with you all, home cooking at first - I was terrified and driving myself nuts worrying about every little vitamin and mineral. What I found with the help of others is: balance over time.

    Some ideas: This past week I made a big batch of doggie meatballs. Ground Beef, raw glutinous rice, raw grated carrots, and egg whites mixed, formed into 4oz meatballs baked in muffin tins. I made three dozen and now they are in the freezer. Quick meals. When fed, I’ll mix with oatmeal and sweet potato - only because my dog needs some carbs. Every pet is different.

    I also learned; it’s okay if within the meat source there is some tendon or a little fat or some skin, etc. If you speak with your store’s butcher they will give you a wholesale price on bulk because they don’t need to make small packages. Buy on sale!
    Pets don’t need really expensive meat cuts. Ricotta cheese, cottage cheese, eggs, yogurt; all count as protein sources.

    If you are unable to cook for your pets, don’t feel bad. We can all only do what we are physically and monetarily able to do. If you need to buy pet food, read your labels, call and ask questions, hound the companies.

    E. I love what your friends are doing. That sounds like a lot of fun, a group cooking for their dogs. I love it!

    Katie

  8. straybaby says:

    llp,

    you can save egg shells and grind them for calcium or try oyster shell calcium. i feed with raw bones, but include eggshells in the diet when it needs balance depending on what’s being fed. i have a dedicated coffee grinder for shells and such. you can also pop a whole egg in a food processor or one of the smaller food choppers and process it and mix it in with ground meat. you can also do up a dozen at a time and freeze them in ice cube trays and then bag the cubes for storage in the freezer. you may be able to find powdered eggshell. i found one supplement that was eggshell, but had D and magnesium (sp?!) added. all usa origins, but i haven’t checked out yet whether the added stuff are ok for the cats/dog with what i’m feeding for balance.

  9. E. Hamilton says:

    Pit Bull Lover, I am light years from fearless, and I have WANTED to quit this fight and turn away so many times, but I did not send a good dog to hell to quit on MY part of the deal. Simple as that.

    Jenny, when this mess quits messing with my appetite and ability to keep what I can eat I will be delighted to take you up on that! I am near to daring the FDA to sue ME by publishing the gag a maggot FDA diet, absolutely guaranteed to kill your desire for food and cause weightloss faster than drinking tap water in Juarez.

    I DREAM about getting some people under oath and in front of a jury. Sad, isn’t it? My subconscious wants Duane on the stand more than it wants Russell Crowe without pants right now.

    Testing the food is STILL something I want to get done , mainly because I think testing will nail some of these a$$holes to the wall.

  10. JJ in IL says:

    Just wanted to ask if all the people who are keeping their pet food til the day they can afford testing - are you storing it in the frig or freezer so it does not go bad or turn moldy? Might that alter the tests you eventually can afford to have done?
    I stopped feeding after the Innova posts so home cook now and my dogs coat is so healthy, soft and shiny. Straybaby good minds think alike - I too home cook like you suggest and rotate but did look up what vitamins and minerals they need and buy the food that has these vitamins and nutrients in it rather than trust vitamins and supplements since I have no idea where they might be from and what they exactly contain. Rather be safe than sorry later.

  11. JJ in IL says:

    E. under oath? Nah, lets just skip that and have a gas chamber handy. Either you fess up or in you go - your choice.

  12. CarolPW says:

    llp

    I’m hyper-sensitive about how things smell so I might not be a good guide, but my favorite (and the pet’s have no objections) is Nature’s Logic All Food Fortifier. Smells like food, natural food sources, and the pet food tastes like food (although if I were eating it I would want more salt and some pepper).

  13. straybaby says:

    JJ,

    yup, i try and have most everything come from whole food sources. cats get clams for taurine along with hearts. and other body parts for essential vitamins/etc. same with the dog. i do supplement, but i buy whole food single supplements and mix my own. it must be something i recognize as a food source like eggshells, nutritional yeast, whole egg powder etc. these are bought after checking the source/origin with the company (mostly organic) and then i buy bulk and store. if my dog and i share stew, for breakfast the next morning she’ll get raw eggs w/shells and some yogurt and whateverelse to balance the missing calcium in the stew. i keep a sort of casual eye on the overall balance. but i’ve been doing it for over 5 years now. i used to use some vitamins, but stopped all vitamins in the home after ChemNutra’s name became public at the begining of April. scary that you can’t even trust buying Vitamin C at the health food store!

    oh, i forgot to mention to all you home feeders and home feeders to be! my dog LOVES smoothies!! berry banana is her fav. we share them after a park romp. used to be only in the summers, but now i have a freezer full of fresh local organic fruits, so we can go until next summer!l lot’s of good stuff in a fruit/yogurt smoothie. i add a whole egg (with shell) in the dogs portion. free range from a local small source. check your farmer’s markets!

  14. E. Hamilton says:

    JJ in IL

    I LIKE that idea!
    Do they twitch and flop in the gas chamber? I kind of have my heart set on the twitching and flopping and may look on Ebay for an “old Sparky” model electric chair. Just in case.

    I hear that if “clerical errors” or “suppliers from China” or some other lame excuse can be made up that the fun can last for hours.
    I wonder, how long does it take between confessions..er..executi..er questioning ..yeah thats it , totally legal questioning in that safe FDA approved chair over there before you can trot in the next one? Should I pack a picnic, make a day of it?

    I have quite the list of potential sizzlers.
    Or gas would be fine, I can be reasonable.

  15. Jenny Bark says:

    E. You got a date. Maybe when this part of the food is over with a lot of us would like to get together & meet but your dinner is on me. Imo the food problem is just starting I think more & more humans are going to start geeting sick. I want to be wrong.

    On Lou Dobbs the other day someone wrote in & wanted to know if it was possible to sue the FDA. Lou laughed & said “now that’s something I would like to see”. I think a lot of people hate Duane besides the pet people. I believe & hope that he will be talked about & in books for years & years to come about all the ugly, evil, hateful ways he did his job.

  16. Pit Bull Lover says:

    What? Another raw vs. cooked debate?

    ;)

  17. Jenny Bark says:

    E. I told you before you come up with the ideas & I’ll do my best to help. You have a lot of us that will do the best we can for you & our babies.

  18. Jenny Bark says:

    E. I’ll go along with the gas chamber if we can have the tv stations their too. All America needs to see that.

  19. Jenny Bark says:

    Pit Bull Lover, No I bet if we ask E. she let one little part raw. I’ll let you ask her.

  20. E. Hamilton says:

    Then Lou ought to be getting a lot of emails letting him know that somebody IS suing the FDA, Don is fighting the good fight and Lou needs to get on board!

    Not getting into the raw versus cooked debate, NOPE, not goin there.

    Toss a mouse in the blender and call it a snack for kitty.
    There was, oh months ago, a thread on petconnection with some things like rat flambe, roadkill delight, pigeon pie,or stuff like that, I lost a really nice pair of panties to that thread. Good luck on finding it now.

  21. Jenny Bark says:

    I did e-mail him about Don, will do it again sure won’t hurt. Might be a good idea if some other people did too. I don’t always express myself that good on the computer. Well do it in the morning because thanks to you & your gas chamber & mouse in the blender I have to clean up before I go to bed.

  22. 5CatMom says:

    Some of the comments about REAL FOOD are great. I started a new thread in the forums. Please help others - share your knowledge and experience.

    See Pet Food Info: News (Recall Related): Real Food - Your Best Defense

    http://itchmoforums.com/news-r.....g24979#new

  23. Rescue4Life says:

    Hi. new here–sick over this–was one of the duped millions using Iams until my eyes were oepned when my precious Freddy was disgnose with HSA and I reseached and found out about the pet food horror. Went to newman’s Own organics–then they were linked with a controversial additive. Adopted two dogs with extreme sensitivities/allergies… Canidae has made them healthy, symptom free and they love it–I used canned lamb & rice mixed with Sr Dry…. Now this. I had tried home-cooked but it didn’t work too well. My husband and I work long hours and eat crap ourselves–I worry about hwta the babies eat far more than myself. I need a reliable, GOOD, prepared pet food. My question is this; IS THERE NOTHING LEFT??????? Is there not even one brand we can trust. ANd of course–now I have $800 worth of Candidae in cans stockpiled b/c of the shortage recently–was terrified to be without it–still payig off credit card bill I used to pay for online order.

    If you really caan’t do home cooked, what is there? Thanks!

  24. E. Hamilton says:

    Rescue4Life says

    There are plenty of folks who are in your situation, I wish I had a good answer for you, I don’t. The desperation and fear and worry part is real familiar, and just as we know about how awful this nightmare is, the pet food companies know what they have done, they just don’t give a damn.

    There are sections in the forum that deal with pet food, you can find help there.
    People will be happy to tell you what they know, welcome to the site and I hope things work out for you and your pets.

  25. Roberto P. says:

    Rescue4Life,
    I honestly thought homecooked was impossible, but my wife and I are doing it. Some people have done serious research and they can help you. Please don’t give up!

  26. Moosemarcy says:

    I also stopped Canidae. So now am home feeding. What do you all think about oatmeal? Is tuna okay? Can anyone give me more idea’s. We eat healthy so I end up giving them what we are eating for dinner. Any suggestions are appreciated. Thanks.

  27. Trudy Jackson says:

    All I know is a little tuna won’t hurt. But it does have mercury in it. so i’m careful with it.

  28. E. Hamilton says:

    If you want clean food and water, move to another planet.
    That is my conclusion.

    Here is the biggest tip I give folks about home cooking for pets.

    Don’t put POISON in the food and you are already doing a better job than the “experts” who somehow managed to bungle the job.

  29. Jenny Bark says:

    Moosemarcy, my 3 dogs had oatmeal with a little bit of cottage cheese for breakfest. My cat had chicken. I don’t know if it is good for them or not but they sure like it. Oatmeal is in Dr. Strombeck’s book. Tonight for supper they will get more protein with thir meal. I give my dogs oatmeal about 2 or 3 times a week. I don’t used canned fish of any kind. I will give all of them a little bit of fresh wild tuna (not from china) off and on. I don’t know as much as a lot of posters on here so you will get more answers. I think as long as you balance the food out over a few days your ok. My babiess blood work is ok. Good luck

  30. Jenny Bark says:

    I agree with what E, Hamilton says. Anything is better than what ever you buy from pfi.

  31. Shadoe says:

    Rescue for life

    I am also new here, but to my knowledge nothing has been proven about Canidae food being tainted. It is all speculation at this point. I have fed Canidae All Life for over 3 years now. When the recall hit, I made phone calls and actually got to speak with a representative of the company! There is a 1-800 number on the cans I suggest you call the company. From these postings, the alleged “tainted” food was a dry kibble anyway. I have not heard that they have tested cans?? Call Canidae. There is not a conspiracy to hurt our animals!

  32. E. Hamilton says:

    Since there sure as hell IS a conspiracy to lie about the death toll and cover up the news, and not pay vet bills like they SAID they would and “silent” recalls and so many other things how, exactly, do you make the leap to trusting a pet food company to tell the truth?

    I have some lovely waterfront land in Las Vegas for sale that might be of interest to you. Healthy for your pets too, the very same healthy pets shown on the big bucks TV ads that the pet food companies are spending money on, instead of paying for the damage caused by POISON sold as premium pet food, can survive being photographed on the only slightly “tainted” with radiation former A-bomb testing site. Now called PFI Acres, the land has very diverse wildlife, some with 3 eyes and 5 legs, bring the kids for a tour!

  33. Jenny Bark says:

    Shadoe, I never have fed Canidae. I use to feed Eulanuba & then after the trouble to National Balance. I have been burnt 2 times & will never feed any commercial again. This is America and you are free to feed anything you feel safe with and so am I. It all comes down to a matter of what anybody trusts. I do also have to say I trust ExperTox labs & so do the courts in USA. Nobody is telling you what to feed. Good Luck.

  34. kb says:

    We’re looking for people to share the expense of testing an unopened bag of Canidae over in the forums.

  35. Denise says:

    I STOPPED feeding Canidae several years ago when I discovered a LARGE piece of blue plastic in the canned food. I contacted the store, the wholesaler and the manufacturer. The store offered to replace the can and then notified the supplier and the manufacturer.

    I notified the manufacturer. They really didn’t care. They told me to send the plastic to them. I sent them pictures of the plastic in the can food as I was opening it and then spread out the plastic on the table, took more pictues, and showed it with a ruler so they could see how big it was. They said maybe it could have been from an ingredients bag that accidently got into the food. Well, I thought, no freakin’ kidding! I didn’t send the plastic. That was the only proof. They could have thrown it out and said it never happened.

    They may have thought I was trying to scam them or something??? I don’t know. But I was feeding 6 large dogs at the time both canned and dry Canidae mixed. I spent hundreds of dollars every two weeks at the feed store. Because of their non response and not caring I switched to another brand. They lo$t a good cu$tomer.

  36. E. Hamilton says:

    What _is_ it with this blue plastic crap in pet food?

    I have seen soooo many things about this blue plastic, weird, just weird. Maybe the blue plastic is what they keep the poison in, or whatever.

    I had a friend find some in a can of pet food and she has it and the can in a bag, saved in the freezer. Freaked her into home cooking.

    Blue plastic, too many times this blue plastic is showing up in pet food.
    Odd.

    I have seen and examined the piece of plastic, this is NOT bag plastic, too hard and thick to be a BAG.

    Maybe we are on to something here.

  37. Denise says:

    Maybe! The plastic I found was thicker than “a normal” plastic bag too. It could be the “viamin or mineral bag” or some other additive. I was glad I found it. I could have accidently fed it and killed a dog!

  38. Katie says:

    Moosemarcy,

    My dog eats 2 - 4 oz of oatmeal every AM, mixed in with her other meal ingredients. My dog requires carbs and cannot exist on a excessively high protein diet. She loss 10% of her body weight on excessively high protein. Vet is working with me and she is now eating 42% protein 24% fat 34% carbs. She is a 12 yr old golden retriever. Oatmeal is good for dogs. Very easy to digest and rich in vitamins and minerals. Some dogs have trouble with raw oatmeal and do better on cooked, higher water content (more gruel like). Another thing I do is mix white rice,brown rice, barley and cook in my slow cooker and add the oatmeal during the last hour to really soften it up. It’s like a gruel to which I add the proteins and/or veggies. My dog has now gained back her weight loss ( she dropped from 45 lbs to 40 lbs in a month, thats how we knew high protein wasn’t working) all animals metabolism is different so keep track of weight gain and loss. I will say on home cooked she has beautiful coat, no itchies, finally normal bloodwork!, clear eyes and good energy level.

    I don’t know about tuna, but I’ve used sardines (blended in the blender) canned salmon, white fish (cod and halibut) with no problems. Some dogs do develop itchies on salmon, if it happens just remove from diet.

    You can make up a big batch of grated vegtables in a processor, freeze in portions and feed raw or lightly cooked depending upon your preference or animals. Watch the animals poop, if the veggies come out as they went in, you need to process more or cook and puree. May sound complicated, but after you find what works for your animal it becomes really simple and quick! And, it is amazing to see the difference between commercial and home cooked.

    Katie

  39. Katie says:

    Royal Canin:
    I heard from some golden retriever breeders that a select group of breed judges and breeders have been invited to Chicago (all expenses paid by Royal Canin) to a seminar where Royal Canin wants their input on developing a commercial food just for goldens. I don’t know if they have plans to do this for the other breeds. But it sounded like they want to produce a breed specific food.

    Me thinks the commercial pet food companies are working the PR in high gear.

    Katie

  40. Trudy Jackson says:

    Yes, Remember I kept finding the blue plastic in the cans of Friskies I was feeding. I kept them all.

  41. E. Hamilton says:

    Trudy, the brand of can that the blue plastic was found in was not that one, I will not post here what brand it was, troll attraction that brand names have, but it is a “supposed to be safe, EXPENSIVE brand” and man, was she ticked to find it!

    I have to go see how many references I can find to this blue plastic in pet food.

  42. Denise says:

    Katie,
    What size dog?
    Denise

  43. Denise says:

    Katie,
    45 lbs for a Golden seems waaay light.

  44. E. Hamilton says:

    I started a thread about the blue plastic in the forums.

    I am finding a whole lot of reports about this plastic, this one color blue from the pics and it all seems to be the same material, ALL of it, no matter what brand.

  45. MarySmith says:

    re: blue plastic

    I’ve read somewhere in the past, that this blue plastic may be ‘ear tags’ from the hogs and cows that are sent to the rendering plants and then find their way into the pet food.

  46. Trudy Jackson says:

    I have to say something about the food We eat. We have a lot of perdue chicken houses in this town. The Mexicans take these buses they cut down and take the baby chickens to the farms. The buses are deisel. My husband is a deisel mechanic. So, when the bus breaks down they bring it to His work. Last year they found a baby chicken left on the bus. i think it got in the glove compartment. this happens all the time, because the babies escape. The guys at work find them everywhere. And under anything you can imagine. After the guys have dropped the babies off they can’t just bring one back and say it got loose. So, they usually leave it and it dies. All the guys have been bringing them home. Last year My husband ended up with one. We had chickens so that was fine. I had to put it in a large cage I have until it got big enough to go out. It started to grow real weired. It got huge in the breast but no where else. and so fast I couldn’t believe it. It could hardly stand up after a while. The body part was just to big to support. I went out to feed it one day and it was dead, tipped upside down. the other guys had the same things happen. I think it got so big so fast that it was too big to support the heart.
    So yesterday, He found another one and it would have been left for the weekend to die so He brought it home. I’m going to watch this one even closer. And take pictures if it does this again.
    They are usually killed at a very early age, so I guess mine was too old. And yet it was still a baby.
    So, since it never had a mother , what in the Hell did they inject into the eggs to get these chickens to grow so fast? Nothing very good, I’m sure. this is really a terrible thing. This is also what We are eating. More chemicals and garbadge.It sure makes You wonder??

  47. Katie says:

    Denise

    My golden’s competition weight in her younger years was 49lb. She is a small golden. At 7 years of age she was diagnosed with reactive histiocytosis (possibly systemic) so she is on long term prednisone to keep the disease under control. She has lost all her muscle mass - so she is even a lighter weight dog now. When the recall came….she ended up with kidney problems… on home cooking her autoimmune disease became completely stabilized, her lesions are gone, and her kidney function tests are back to normal. But my vet and I found she needs carbs in the way of some grains to maintain body weight. She is a very active 12 year old. Reason I found it is really important to remember when home cooking or even buying commercial dog food that all dogs can be different metabolically and have different needs. I found with my dog, while I could take a diet “template”, I needed to watch her weight and activity level and add or delete food items. Something else that is different for her, and I don’t know if it is the result of the cont. food in Feb. or just the years on commercial food - but in order for her to benefit from a home cooked diet, I need to puree all grains and veggies to a gruel form and shred my chicken or turkey. She does better on grd hamburger than on beef stew meat. Maybe all the years of commercial food messed up her GI tract!

    Katie

  48. Denise says:

    The blue plastic I found was a ragged sheet approx 12″ x 5″. It was probably only a piece of a larger sheet. It was stretched and torn a bit on the edges, like it was ripped off. In the can it was sort of spiraled and twisted tightly.

    It wouldn’t surprise me if an ear tag made it in. It would be more like a poker chip type fragment I think.

  49. Katie says:

    Is the blue plastic like the recyclable bags used in some places?

    Katie

  50. E. Hamilton says:

    Katie, no it is stiffer than bag material. I just got back from looking at the piece I know about and that thing has a wicked sharp edge on it , it could very well perforate MY stomach if I ate it and whether it is ear tags from cattle or not that does NOT belong in pet food.
    And I am going out tomorrow to look at an assortment of “ear tags” because I really do not think that is what it is.

    I have talked to several people today who have some ideas.

    Geez, the more you look the more you find I guess, too bad the industry that makes the crap food is not all that concerned. But we knew that already.

    Sigh.

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