Menu Foods Releases Claims Information

Menu Foods has posted information regarding the reimbursement process for veterinary care costs on its Web site — almost 2 months after the initial recall.

The form (PDF) also lists more than 50 class action lawsuits being filed in the US. Receiving reimbursement would mean that you “release any and all claims for damages.” So consider carefully if you would like to proceed with getting a reimbursement directly from Menu Foods.  A separate Canadian process is available (PDF).

Unfortunately, filling out the form requires several pieces of information from the recalled food packages, which many pet owners have discarded or returned based on the recall instructions previously provided to consumers. No instructions are given on how customers will be reimbursed if they are unable to provide full information due to the lack of recalled food containers.

If you have dealt with the Menu Foods claims company and have more information, please email us.

141 Responses to “Menu Foods Releases Claims Information”

  1. Steve says:

    Feb 20th - Menu Foods receives first reports of problems with pet food.
    Feb 26th - Menu foods commence tests on 50 animals.
    Feb 26th & 27th - Menus CFO sells half his shares for $102,900.
    March 16th - Recall announced. Share price plunges
    April 10th - CFO calls this a “horrible coincidence”

    Don’t run scared of these people. Give them a taste of their own medicine and more.

  2. 5CatMom says:

    The news from MENU FOODS INCOME FUND:

    “Menu Foods Income Fund Reaches Agreements With Its Bank and Noteholders”

    http://tsedb.globeinvestor.com.....g=391040_1

  3. Steve says:

    Had Enough????

    Nationwide Class Action Lawsuit Filed Against Pet Food Companies and Retailers For Misleading Consumers Regarding the Contents of Pet Food

    “Premium” Pet Food Marketed and Sold as “Complete and Balanced” Has Historically Contained Such Items as Euthanized Dogs and Cats, Restaurant Grease, Hair, Hooves, and Diseased Animals, and Other Inedible Garbage

    MIAMI, FL — May 15, 2007 — A cat and dog owner from Michigan and two cat and dog owners from Florida have filed a nationwide class action against food industry giants Mars, Inc., Proctor and Gamble Co., Colgate Palmolive Company, Del Monte Foods, Co., and Nestle U.S.A. Inc. These manufacturers have a combined approximate 70% of the market share in the $16 billion dollar a year pet food industry. The suit also names as Defendants Nutro Products, Inc., Menu Foods, Wal-Mart Stores, Inc. Target Corp., Publix Supermarkets, Inc., Winn Dixie Stores, Inc., as manufacturers and marketers of their own brand pet food and retailers PETCO Animal Supplies, Inc., Pet Supermarket, Inc., and Petsmart Inc.

    http://www.mflegal.com/petfoodlawsuit

  4. 5CatMom says:

    The lenders who decided to do business with the Menu Foods must not be aware of the facts.

    Here’s a fact: Never again will I buy a food that has any connection with Menu.

  5. menusux says:

    Would like to see people like ChemNutra, Wilbur-Ellis and Cereal Byproducts listed in lawsuits, as they are just as guilty of negligence as Menu, et. al.

    Had they tested the products they imported, it would have been known that all of this was adulterated wheat flour, not wheat gluten or rice protein concentrate. This in itself would have stopped its distribution to the various pet food companies, simply because it was not what was ordered.

    After the discovery that it was wheat flour by CN, W-E, etc., any or all of them may have called for further testing and that probably would have uncovered the melamine. At any rate, the discovery of the wheat flour, melamine-contaminated or not, would have been enough to keep it out of the food supply.

    Menu is one of those suing CN re: the false wheat gluten, but had Menu done its own testing upon receiving the CN shipments, they would have known what was received was not what was ordered. And the CN orders would have stopped then and there–because they ordered and paid for wheat gluten but got wheat flour. Same can be said for those who received “RPC” from W-E. The “RPC” via W-E, and via Cereal Byproducts failed 3 times–no test by W-E, no test by CB, and no test by the pet food companies who were the end users of it.

    There’s a legal term referred to as “ordinary care”. Basically, what it breaks down to is that if you borrowed a friend’s cell phone and your kid flushed it down the you-know-where, you’d be liable to replace the phone. Would be because the law would contend that you would be keeping a cell phone of yours away from the child’s reach (so this couldn’t happen to it). They’d then go on to say that you failed to use “ordinary care” with the borrowed phone, so the liability to make good for it was yours.

    With respect to this, it looks like “ordinary care” (testing imported and purchased products received) never existed in ANY of the businesses involved. It also shows the incompencies in these businesses from the company angle, because none of them tested even from the standpoint of checking to see that they got what they paid for.

    Even if we purposely omit the word “melamine” in all of this, they are all guilty of adulteration, because wheat flour is not wheat gluten or RPC, and guilty of that by not using ordinary care.

  6. YaYa says:

    Out of the Food cesspool come the cesspool leeches.

    I didn’t bother to read the claim form. What’s the cap? $500 like the others?

    Would NOT even cover the Cost {price} of my First cat that got sick. Nor the Value to me of what Both these cats mean to me. The one that I had to put to sleep in 05 nor the one that’s going through a long De-toxification now. Since I know I jumped on this with her ASAP and she did not have the damage or reactions of the “norm”. :-(
    {and I’m not saying that if someone else had done the same or differently than me the would still have a cat that’s alive as mine is. She just did not get as much and I think she was Incredibly health and— a Mutt cat :-) }
    It’s STILL coming out of her now!

    I miss my Shimi-Cat still, my cat left and I Both do!
    They were like Mutt and Jeffa.

    Tho my Kitty now is adjusted to being an only cat and *I* am her bud now.

    Folks still talk about my Shimi.

    A suit, won’t help me.
    I know I’m not alone in that. And that’s where the Big Manufacturers will get “off”. And that S__KS!

  7. YaYa says:

    Let me Clarify. Cesspool leeches= CEO’s. CFO’s, PQR’s and XYZ’s!

    I’ll Never forget my First visit to the Menu Foods website. I saw “Menu Fooods *Income Fund*” and my heart and mind just sunk.

    An Income Fund, making Food. Right out there for the World to see. {as if they were PROUD of it!}

    We did not know.
    Never crossed our minds.
    We Trusted them.

    Who would have Ever thought, you have to Investigate the Foods you feed your FAMILY in Great Detail????????
    In this day and age and with the technology we have we should not have to.

    I’m Sorry, I’m ranting again and don’t want some “Suit” reading what I’m typing now, so that in court they can *Label* US as irrational.

    Remember THAT part folks when You post.
    They’ll be looking for ANY loophole for the Court cases. Don’t be one, that might Provide one {some} for them! Believe me they are coyping- EVERY WORD HERE. {and other websites now} You can Bank on That.

  8. Steve says:

    Two Die After Eating Instant Noodles
    Thursday, 10 May 2007
    TWO Ulaanbaatar students have died after eating Chinese-made instant noodles. The noodles, which come in a red packet and cost Tg 150 or US$0.10, are widely sold in shops here. The Mongolian news website www.oops.mn reported the deaths last week.

    The noodles are thought to have contained toxic waste water which went undetected during the production process in China.
    “There is a real risk from these contaminated products and we will not sell these noodles again until we are completely sure they are safe,” said Chris Essier, marketing manager at Everyday supermarket in the students’ quarter, a major stockist of the noodles.

    “We have removed all Chinese-produced instant noodles from our stores and now only sell Korean and Japanese varieties.”
    However, traders at the Bombogor Wholesale Center and in smaller shops around Ulaanbaatar continue to sell the noodles. “We still sell them as customers still want to buy them,” said one trader who asked not to be named.

    http://tinyurl.com/2pkdt3

  9. YaYa says:

    ITCHMO, *would you*, could you Tell, US; if You were subpoenaed??? :-P

  10. Linda says:

    Steve wrote:
    ““Premium” Pet Food Marketed and Sold as “Complete and Balanced” Has Historically Contained Such Items as Euthanized Dogs and Cats, Restaurant Grease, Hair, Hooves, and Diseased Animals, and Other Inedible Garbage”

    Steve please don’t post such comments unless you also give a credible source link. An attorneys website does not count, as they are biased and in it for the money. Show us some credible proof that these things are in pet food. Wait…you can’t. You are using scare-tactics that is uncalled for. Pet food products in the U.S. CAN NOT, and DO NOT contain euthanized dogs and cats and diseased animals, or feathers and such.

    Yes, they(the byproducts) can contain intestines and other meat product reminents that are “leftovers” that we don’t eat. But it is not chicken beaks, brains, feathers and stuff like that.

    I’m tired of uninformed people on this website using scare tactics, to make people buy different food for their pets. Next time provide credible proof. Are you someone that works in a processing plant or slaughter house that actually sees the ingredients going into pet food?

  11. martin says:

    MAY 15, 2007 - 17:16 ET

    Menu Foods Income Fund Reaches Agreements With Its Bank and Noteholders

    TORONTO, ONTARIO–(CCNMatthews - May 15, 2007) -

    NOT FOR RELEASE OVER US NEWSWIRE SERVICES

    Attention Business/Financial Editors:

    Menu Foods Income Fund (TSX:MEW.UN) announced today that it has reached agreements with its bank and the holders of its senior secured notes (collectively, the “Lenders”), which among other things, define the terms and conditions governing the Fund’s US$30 million bank and US$85 million senior secured notes facilities (US$75 million outstanding), going forward. In addition, the Fund entered into an agreement with its bank for a new US$20 million credit facility.

    The new bank facility, and Menu’s existing bank facility, will both extend to June 30, 2009. Under the new agreements all borrowings, including those under the existing bank and senior secured notes facilities will carry rates of 4.75% and 5.30% over LIBOR, for the bank and the senior secured notes, respectively. These interest rates will continue to apply until the additional US$20 million facility is extinguished and the balance owing under the US$30 million facility is less than US$15 million for five consecutive business days and Menu achieves a total debt to EBITDA ratio, on a trailing twelve months basis, of 3 to 1 or less, at which time the interest rates will revert to those set out in Menu’s existing facilities, provided that there are no other defaults.

    Under the terms of the amended agreements, not more than CDN$45 million may be utilized by the Fund for recall-related costs. Furthermore, the amended facilities require the Fund to pay fees to the Lenders, plus all associated professional costs, and modify certain covenants until such time as the US$20 million bank facility is repaid.

    http://menufoods.com/recall/index.html

  12. Steve says:

    How bout you prove to us this stuff Linda isn’t getting into the food.

    Get Busy

  13. Steve says:

    Ekedahl

    “We recognize there is a definite need for improved surveillance,” he said. “This can be done in a way so that there is not a heavy burden of regulation.” The industry sells $15 billion of pet food a year.

    Oh really? And how do you propose that since your the one who’s probably as much responsible for this mess as anyone.

  14. 3FURS says:

    A few months ago, I took out a MILK BONE dog biscuit for my dog. The end of it was broken off and a nice little white bird/chicken feather was baked into the biscuit.

  15. LorieVA says:

    Linda,

    Not taking eithr side of this debate but I think thre are more bad things than good thngs in our pet food, and actually the USDA IMO has been know to turn a blind eye now and again to a downer cow or two. If pet food was human grade it was cost more than a buck a can. Think about it.

    http://www.api4animals.org/facts?more=1&p=359

  16. menusux says:

    http://www.aplus-flint-river-r.....?win=small

    “Animal by-products are ground, rendered, and cleaned slaughtered meat carcass parts such as necks, feet, undeveloped eggs, bones, heads, and intestines (and a small amount of feathers in the case of chicken) — yes, by-products are as gross and disgusting as they sound. The quality of animal by-products is very inconsistent between batches.

    “In many cases, by-product meals are derived from “4-D” meat sources — defined as food animals that have been rejected for human consumption because they were presented to the meat packing plant as “Dead, Dying, Diseased or Disabled.”

    “AAFCO Definition for Meat By-Products

    “”Meat by-products is the non-rendered, clean parts, other than meat, derived from slaughtered mammals. It includes, but is not limited to, lungs, spleen, kidneys, brain, livers, blood, bone, partially defatted low temperature fatty tissue, and stomachs and intestines freed of their contents. It does not include hair, horns, teeth and hoofs. It shall be suitable for use in animal food. If it bears name descriptive of its kind, it must correspond thereto.”

    “Animal by-products are commonly found in the majority of lower-grade pet foods and even many of the larger name brands that market themselves as “premium pet food” manufacturers, including Science Diet (even their prescription diet product line), Purina (both Purina One and Purina Pro Plan), and Iams / Eukanuba. Ingredients listed as “beef, chicken, and/or poultry byproducts” on pet food labels are not required to include actual meat, and “rendered meat” on labels can refer to ANY rendered mammal meat, including dogs and cats! ”

    DE and all PF company executives are considered to be mammals–with this definition of meat by-products, and and all of them could be rendered into the products they regulate and sell…..

  17. menusux says:

    Sorry- meant to say ANY and all of them…

  18. 3FURS says:

    Oh, and one time I saw a piece of red plastic in the same brand of dog biscuit. I thought that maybe it just was a piece of some machine they used. I just threw these biscuits away, and thought it was some innocent accident. That was long before any of these new revelations.

  19. LorieVA says:

    3FURS,

    That red looking plastic was probably part of a pets collar………………..

  20. martin says:

    Oh LarieVA, that was terrible :-{

  21. ally says:

    From the book, “Food Pets Die For: Shocking Facts About Pet Food.” By Ann N. Martin.:

    “…companion animals from clinics, pounds, and shelters can and are being rendered and used as sources of protein in pet food”

    “The slaughterhouses where cattle, pigs, goats, calves, sheep, poultry, and rabbits meet their fate, provide more fuel for rendering. After slaughter, heads, feet, skin, toenails, hair, feathers, carpal and tarsal joints, and mammary glands are removed. This material is sent to rendering. Animals who have died on their way to slaughter are rendered. Cancerous tissue or tumors and worm-infested organs are rendered. Injection sites, blood clots, bone splinters, or extraneous matter are rendered. Contaminated blood is rendered. Stomach and bowels are rendered. Contaminated material containing or having been treated with a substance not permitted by, or in any amount in excess of limits prescribed under the Food and Drug Act or the Environmental Protection Act. In other words, if a carcass contains high levels of drugs or pesticides this material is rendered.”

    Not taking sides either. Just sayin’ we all know that many involved in the pet food industry are far from being saints.

  22. YaYa says:

    I know LorieVA will probably beat me to this but, Yes Martin, a pet collar. I’ve read in the same types of post ith more details than the one you posted on the various catagories of By-Products that; they do Not stop to take the time to remove tags or collars. {including FLEA collars}

    Lots of livestock have ear tags as well. {as in a pierced ear ring}

  23. Terri says:

    Never posted here before but I do read almost every day. Anyway I wanted to pass an FYI along…….. if any of you feed your pets Dr’s Foster & Smith food ( some were hit by the recall, but not all) they no longer have their recall page up.

  24. martin says:

    Dead Animal Removal and Disposal:
    For farmers, meat processors and the livestock industry
    Valley Proteins provides timely and dependable response to calls for the collection of dead and down livestock in a limited service area. The agriculture and meat processing industries have come under increasingly tighter regulatory scrutiny for the disposal of dead and downer livestock. Valley Proteins provides an efficient and safe means of disposing of these animals by collecting and processing the carcasses at one of our environmentally sound rendering plants. The carcasses collected are recycled into quality animal feed ingredients and the hides are processed for the industrial leather trade.
    For more information please contact rendering@valleyproteins.com.
    http://www.valleyproteins.com/.....emoval.asp

  25. LorieVA says:

    martin,

    I am sorry I was joking, but I have heard fact or fiction who knows anymore that they do not take collars off pets, tags of livestock, and also the packaging off spoiled meat……………………..just grind it all up together we will never know and to be honest I never even thought about any of this till this whole mess started. I just trusted the pet food companies and who ever watches them. Boy was I dumb!!!!!!!!!!!!! They say that if you test some of the foods there is a low dose of the drug they use to put pets down in each can.

  26. martin says:

    YaYa,

    Just the thought of it makes me ill. I wish I could actually believe it really wasnt a collar but I wouldnt doubt it was.

  27. LorieVA says:

    YA YA,

    LOL you beat me.

  28. YaYa says:

    Terri, Thanks for posting. I guess that since they do it by Mail-order {that’s my understanding}, that they must think they’ve covered their butts; in contacting all of their affected customers. AND having a Recall info sheet {on website or in a store right now} is Not good future PR for the companies.
    Future customers coming, would never know.

    They know a Real BAD case of the UGLIES is coming and don’t want to be affilitated with a Recall.

    IMHO :-)

  29. LorieVA says:

    Actually I posted this before my nail tech from Vietnam says she feeds her dog people food because her cousin in Vietnam who owns a chicken farm has a dumpster on site specifically for dead chickens, to be put in for a pet food company to come pick up weekly.

  30. martin says:

    ally,

    I read that book. My vet told me it contained NO FACTS AT ALL. I still believe it does!!!

  31. Susan says:

    I though these links were interesting…..
    This article is about a BSE positive cow put in pet food in Canada in 2003.
    http://www.fsis.usda.gov/OPPDE.....034N-1.pdf
    Here’s another one from Nebraska Dept of Ag about how to prepare meat unfit for human consumption for use in pet food.
    http://www.agr.state.ne.us/regulate/bai/tilf.htm
    This one’s about the shortage of protein and using “inedible meat” to provide it.
    http://www.inspection.gc.ca/en.....1-6e.shtml

  32. Steve says:

    What angered me is the way the PF Industry attempted to cover this thing up.

    Thats the bottom line. Go ahead. Slam me all you want.

  33. martin says:

    LorieVA,

    No need to apologize at all. Joke or not, I’ll bet your right! The thought of it is just horrible. But look at the industry we are talking about. If an old beat up shoe added a little weight and could be ground up enough they would throw it in there too.

    However,.the shoe would be healthier than what they put in there now.

  34. ally says:

    martin,

    I haven’t yet read the book. Just did a search on feathers & whatnot with “pet food” on Google and all sorts of things came up, including that book’s excerpt. I know enough to know you have to weed through what the ‘net turns up as fact or fiction. Just found that part interesting and the author was also featured on Advocacy for Animals.

    It wouldn’t surprise me one iota what all’s been rendered into pet food over the years. But one thing I can say - I know better now. We ALL do. Not only concerning learning more about the ingredients in our pet’s food, but also in our very own.

    I don’t care what kind of spin the FDA or USDA or anyone cares to put out there. I’m not buying into it a second time. Uh-huh, no way. Buyer beware indeed….

  35. YaYa says:

    I’d ask, then Just WHAT Do they do with all of the “nasty” stuff? They sure don’t bury it {contaminats the soil} and they sure don’t have Kilns buring day and night burning the remains; that too would contaminate the air {and people would complain about the smoke and smells, and insist it Stop}.

    They singe the fur/hair off and then it goes to processing etc. Singeing does Not burn off the collars etc. or “Kill-off”, antibotics, or other drugs, flea preventive articles-in or On the animals if ‘pets’ etc, nor does it Kill disease.
    I’m sorry to be ‘graphic’ but, the cooking process is way down the line at the plants.

    I hope I spelled “singe” correctly!

    Blech :-þþþ

  36. Susan says:

    Is it possible to get pet food approved for sale in the EU? This sounded better to me than what we have in the US.
    “European Parliament and Council regulation 1774/2002 establishes the health rules concerning animal by-products not intended for human consumption and replaces Directive 90/667/EEC. This regulation as well as the TSE regulation was developed in response to the BSE crisis and is part of the EU’s strategy to eradicate food-borne crises. The animal by-products regulation covers all animal products not intended for human consumption, and as such covers both products for technical uses and animal by-products used in the production of feeds and pet food. This regulation requires that animal by-products used in the production of feeds and pet food be derived from the carcasses of animal declared fit for human consumption following veterinary inspection (category 3 products in the regulation). Provisions include a ban on intra-species recycling and fallen stock and restrictions on yellow grease. Certain categories of pet food have to be denatured with specified substances. Pet food plants have to be dedicated to production of product fit for human consumption.”
    http://useu.usmission.gov/agri/by-products.html

  37. YaYa says:

    It’s all “relative”.

    I just heard that Greenies ask that you not wash your Blue jeans but only after every *5* wearings. The DYES in blue jeans yuck up the water and soil. And saves on energy in the washing and drying process.

    One other thought, one on the chemicals {drugs, fleas repellents, tick dust or what ever, you name it, On lvestock} in and on animals and Heat.

    I would think Some of them may have a “molecular change” in Heat. That’s be-fore it goes into the cans.

    Hmmmmmmmmm— wonder What it all becomes when you add a little Melamine {alone} with THAT brew?

  38. Dogmom says:

    Many years ago, I took my new puppy to a class called “puppy kindergarten”. The first class was without the dogs and we were told what we would be doing, what our puppies would learn and what we needed to bring with us to class. Before the instuctor let us go, she surveyed the class as to what we were feeding our dogs. Many said Purina Puppy chow. She nodded, presented a blender, a pitcher of water and a brand new sealed bag of Purina Puppy Chow. She poured some of the chow into the blender, added water and ran it for a minute or two. Then she turned off the machine, took off the lid and passed the container around for us to see what was in it. There was alot of short hairs floating on top of the mixture. While we gasped in disgust; she explained about the four “D’s” in pet food and said that while hair is protien, it in not digestible protien. I repeated the test at home to show my husband and from that moment on, we have never used Purina products.

  39. Barb, GSD MOM says:

    I wonder if the premium foods have rendered meats in them???????????

    DogMom: I forwarded your message to my Purina Sisters. They all feed them Purina One. they will not listen to me. So far, so good for them.

    Wow, is all I can say about these blogs.

  40. Dogmom says:

    It is an easy to replicate test if you have a common household blender and the ingredients. This was in 1988; do not know if they have “improved” their formula. Cynic that I am, I suspect they have not.

  41. purringfur says:

    “If an evil force could devise an agent capable of damaging the human race, he would make it indestructible, distribute it as widely as possible in animal feed so that it would pass to man, and program it to cause disease slowly so that everyone would have been exposed to it before there was any awareness of its presence,” British microbiologist, Richard Lacey.

    Richard F. Marsh, “Comments on Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy,” Journal of the American Veterinary Medical Association, v. 197, no. 4 (Aug. 15, 1990), p. 441.

  42. LorieVA says:

    Dogmom,

    That is an amazing story, disgusting but very informative. I wish i still had my IAMS from last year to try this with. May try it with my dry eukanuba, and Hill SD C/D, but then again I do not want hair in my blender.

  43. YaYa says:

    Yep Dogmom, even the singeing process is not a complete well done job. If a collar goes in what matters a little hair huh. sigh.

    It’s a two fold Solution.
    1. Dead Animals of All kinds and from all manners. Thousands every day just on the road sides alone. Just what did we think they did with all of the Accidental ones alone, all these years.
    I honestly thought the County “pick-up” services Burned them, after they do a morning run down the roads.
    2. So the Dead {and dying animals} go into a money making Process= Pet Food. Over, done with, Gone.

    It never crossed my mind it would be, could be, More, till this.

    This is sort of off topic but, does anyone remember: isn’t it the French that thinks and eat Horse meat as a Prime meat for humans?

    I luv buffalo meat, but it is Raised to be eaten now days alot. Beefalo is also good. Both are Better meats for Humans than Beef.

    Question: But do we here in America, eat such distasteful things like some Foreign countries do? I just can’t think of any-thing.

  44. Helen says:

    LorieVA: You don’t need the blender, just put some of the food in a bowl of water and let it sit there until it dissolves.

  45. Sylvia says:

    “Linda’s” tactic might have had a little sway before hospitals and graves and urns were full of companion animals sickened killed by the pet food industry.

  46. LorieVA says:

    Helen
    Good idea, have to wait till a day my stomach is feeling up to it.

  47. Helen says:

    LorieVA: You got that right. :P

  48. Sylvia says:

    Purringfur, you will get me into “conspiracy mode” again!

  49. Mandy says:

    Dogmom that is horrifying. I don’t have a dog, but my cats used to eat Cat Chow and Purina one till one of them started throwing up when she ate it. I am trying to feed them something else, but my older cat is stubborn and doesn’t want anything else. I am doing everything I can think of to tempt her into eating the new food, but she just looks at me like I’m crazy.

    I keep hearing this over and over. My cats only want the food that made them sick. It is very frustrating to think that these rotten companies got our pets addicted to junk food. I heard they spray things on the food that make them smell and taste tempting.

    Obviously I will not let my cat starve. If I have to I’ll resort to feeding her people food with suppliments. At least I know what NOT to feed my cats from now on.

    I am angry and frustrated about this whole situation. I’m boycotting Purina products forever!

  50. lainie says:

    Lets Start With By Products. Those Of You That Talk About What Dogs And Cats Eat When They Naturally Hunted Think 4a Minute Will You Nature Wastez Nothing. Ever See A Stray Eat A Mouse Rat Or Bird It Caught. It Doeznt Peel Back The Fur Or Pluck The Feathers It Eats Everything. Those Of U Cooking @ Home Need To Add Ground Bone For Calcium So Why Shouldnt It Be In Dog Food. Red Plastic Is Another Issue All Togethr. But As For Lungs, Kidneys, Hearts And What Not They Are Rich In Alot Of Natural Nutrients. Just A Bit Of Food For Thought Chemicals And The Other Garbage Iz The Problem Not The By Products.

  51. Genny says:

    “”How bout you prove to us this stuff Linda isn’t getting into the food.

    Get Busy”"

    LMAO at Steve but biting tongue.

  52. LorieVA says:

    lainie,

    I think the main complaint is some of the PF companies are saying human grade food and slipping some of this waste into the product on the down low.

  53. Helen says:

    You know, when cats in my family have caught critters outside, they actually do leave the feet, fur, feathers and other whatnot lying around. My cat is indoor, but I grew up with outdoor cats.

  54. 4lgdfriend says:

    poster said: wonder if the premium foods have rendered meats in them???????????

    “Meals” are rendered, are they not?
    Most “poultry fat” is rendered, is it not?

    anyone?

  55. 4lgdfriend says:

    Steve’s in rare form today. Several are in rare form today! ;-)
    way to go.

  56. 4lgdfriend says:

    Here, let me help ;-) http://www.dogfoodproject.com/index.php?page=intro Commercial Dry Foods-Intro: Of course every company is going to tell you that they are using only the best quality ingredients, but the constitutional right to freedom of speech does not require such statements to be truthful.”
    http://altvedmed.com” One 1985 scientific paper examined pHentobarbital levels (an anesthetic agent used in euthanasia solutions) in pet food derived from dogs and cats that had been euthanized at shelters. This practice was still relatively common in the year 2000! A dog or cat on one of the very cheapest diets may be eating pet food that contains the remains of other pet dogs and cats, and the pHentobarbital levels may be significant.1 Slaughterhouse animals rejected for human use due to high antibiotic levels also make their way into pet foods. The American Journal of Cardiology has warned that children allergic to penicillin could die from accidentally eating pet food!2
    The moral to this horror story is this: some pet food manufacturers have determined (supported by scientists, nutritionists and government representatives) that meat rejected for humans is fine for cats and dogs. Considering the things that some pets eat, given the choice (yuck!), this may be true. However, many owners prefer to feed human-grade meat. Some veterinarians even feel that this is more appropriate for animals with health problems. If you prefer human grade meat, you must find a company which uses it
    FOOD EVEN A DOG SHOULDN’T EAT—KILLING OUR PETS WITH EVERY MEAL: http://drjackie.freeservers.co.....a_dog.html
    PETFOOD – OUR ANIMALS ARE DYING FOR IT http://www.homestead.com/VonHapsburg/petfood.html
    http://www.sojos.com/eatitarticle.html EAT IT, I DARE YA! Fish meal for pets is stabilized with ethoxyquin at a level of 400-1000 parts per million. That’s a lot of rubber preservative!

  57. 4lgdfriend says:

    speaking of 4D 1. http://www.usatoday.com/news/w.....t-bush.htm
    President’s uncle shares Bush family ties to China
    2/18/2002 USA Today

  58. YaYa says:

    And you know what, I saw a possum last week on the way to the barn, running around with a collar on. Wonder if the PF Co. they take their collars off too? :-þ

    Ah I’m just pullin’ your leg folks; my points: but the percentages of a Cow versus a Possum, going into the Rendering plant are probably higher for a cow. AND I doubt the Possum has been Vaccinated or had drug treatment for various things or dusted for pest in the pastures etc.
    I consider the method of the rendering; and What is rendered, I’d prefer a Possum over a Cow with the ‘Cleaner’ body actually, for my cat. But we don’t have, haven’t been given, the CHOICE, of what’s In the foods. {yes there were/are speciality foods but a pain in the butt to find and get, imho}

    Sure fresh is better. But Helen is right, they Do leave certain things Un-eaten. Some parts are just bad.

    Animals know Fresh. With us, they haven’t had a “choice” and neither have we for the most part.

    Then again you might have the type like my old 23 pound country Tom cat, who’d bring ME “the gifts” {out of love} and lay them at my door step :-P
    When he Did eat his kill, he did Not eat Feathers.

    {No I’d not want my animals eating possums. They are carion eaters themselves, on top of being Filthy.}

  59. 4lgdfriend says:

    ah yes….and then theres:
    Union of Concerned Scientists: The Reality of Feed at Animal Factories http://www.ucsusa.org/food_and.....-what.html Animal feed legally can contain rendered road kill, dead horses, and euthanized cats and dogs.
    Rendered feathers, hair, skin, hooves, blood, and intestines can also be found in feed, often under catch-all categories like “animal protein products.”

  60. Kiki says:

    I hardly think that you can compare survival in nature and the inputs that go into the rendering process.

    Whatever the end result of rendering ends up to be, it is not easily apparent what it actually started as - old, rotted and rotting meat with plastic packaging, tumored out diseased and decaying rotting flesh, maggots, flea collars, etc…Only buzzards pick at rotting flesh. Animals in the wild eat fresh kill. They can also tell/smell what is diseased and they don’t eat pus, maggots, tumors, or gangrened flesh. All that routinely goes into your favorite commerical brand rendered pet product and then they have to spray on a thick layer of rendered fat to even get the animals to consider eating it….gross. Listen if you want to feed your animals that stuff in the name of “nature”, be my guest. Not even a wild, starving beast would eat what goes into your pet food.

    Summary: I hardly think it is a viable comparison…

  61. 4lgdfriend says:

    and let’s not forget: http://free.financialmail.co.z…../dfeat.htm
    Anyone buying a dog food marked “pure beef” would assume the beef content to be close to 100%. They would be wrong. To qualify as “pure”, the food needs to contain only 65% beef. The rest is fat, starch and additives. A food promising “beef flavour” has less than 4% beef, “with beef” at least 4%, “high in beef” means 14%, and “beef dinner” is 26%.
    “They may seem low percentages but these are globalised definitions,” says Hundley. “The SA industry is following standards set in the rest of the world.”

  62. 4lgdfriend says:

    ah. I feel better now ;-)

  63. Genny says:

    Helen,

    I’ve seen remains from my cats’ bird hunts, too. Sometimes they want even eat the mice/rats, just toss and play till they want move any longer then place them in the exact spot where I’ll take my first step out on the porch. I always wondered why they didn’t always eat them. Think they could tell they weren’t edible for some reason?

  64. Kiki says:

    Helen: what is the “whatnot” portion that is left by your pets? Just curious????

  65. Kiki says:

    yes - meal = rendered…

  66. Kiki says:

    Ah, K’s ppl are here!!

  67. straybaby says:

    meal= processed

    personally i think we should have meal rating standards in meals that are not by-product meals and ones that are.

    we should prob do the same with glutens and protein concentrates.

    on the labels that is . .

  68. Kiki says:

    The problem is rendering plants per se. The problem is linking rendering plants with pet food. They need to use the product of rendering (which is a supposedly environmentally sound way of dealing with carcasses) for some other non-nutritional purpose - such as non-agricultural fertilizer or something of that nature.

    Secondly, vets can’t be disposing of deceased pets via a lucrative account with renderingmanUSA without explicit informed consent from the pet owner. In other words, vets need to be explicit as to what they will do with the body - please let the pet owner choose what is best. I never realized how much money vets made as a result of our deceased pets - we pay them to dispose of our pets remains (unless we pay extra for cremation), then the vets get paid by the rendering plant based on how many dead pets he has every week, then the vet gets paid a % of pet food sales, which include the dead pet that was rendered…talk about double, triple dipping…sorry, but it is what it is. I know vet techs who have told me the dirty little secrets. INFORMED CONSENT is what it is all about baby….and what happens to be supremely lacking in these pet industries.

  69. Kiki says:

    I’m sorry - I meant to say that rendering plants are NOT the problem per se…

  70. Zoe says:

    Sounds like “Linda” (May 16th, 2007 at 12:28 pm) works for a “premium” pet food company.

  71. Zoe says:

    I meant to add:

    Go Steve!

  72. straybaby says:

    forgot to mention. i feed my pets by-products. fresh ones, but by products just the same. i may find chicken feet disgusting, but they don’t ;)

  73. Kiki says:

    Oh yeah - a mole - but definitely not a troll.

  74. Kiki says:

    I thinking picking and choosing your by-products is great - no problem there - fresh by-products - no problem in my eyes.

  75. Genny says:

    “”Ah, K’s ppl are here!!” or alter egos.

    *back to biting tongue*

  76. Helen says:

    Kiki: The occasional bone, organ, head, tail. I am talking about prey that was eaten. Sometimes they would bring them as gifts, but the ones they ate, they did not eat the “by products”. They ate the parts they could digest. Who would have thought? OK, I know some predators including housecats do eat the occasional foot, head, or feather. Ours never did that I could see.

  77. straybaby says:

    Kiki Says:
    May 16th, 2007 at 5:03 pm

    is there back up somewhere that supports vets getting paid for turning over deceased pets for rendering? and if it’s an old source, anything recent?

    the only *disposal* service i’ve been offered from vets has been mass or separate cremation (spelled out, not just “do you want us to dispose of the body?”)

  78. Kiki says:

    ooops sorry to bring it up…just happy to see ya!

  79. YaYa says:

    4lgdfriend says: ah. I feel better now ;-)
    LMBO! Toooo funny!

    Yes it’s True this stuff has been in the Pet foods for years. And the classification are standard and Meat by-products and By products are 2 different things etc. And that Pure don’t mean diddley as far as Percentage.

    We’ve Learned. Now we must Politely educate folks as we go.

    I’d no more give someone a hard time about their choices or what’s available to them at that time etc., than any thing.
    Just stive to do better, it’s All we can do. THEN the Levels will Elevate to what we ALL have Thought and All Want NOW!
    Use what you’ve learned, do it decently and not in a smallify em’ way. With class and knowledge.

    If someone is Open to listening, Explain it.
    If someone Ask, Explain it.

    But remember it’s Tough to change the ingrained and what’s feed to us on TV everyday since WE were kids.
    YOU can’t change Anyone. It’s up to them to do it by choice after being given the Knowledge.

    You catch alot more with honey. Well at least for the next 4 years you might! :-P
    Thank you Einstein! :-D

  80. Kiki says:

    I’m sure I can find info on this - it’s routine. In fact, one southern town decided that they didn’t want anymore dead pets to go to the rendering plant and the carcasses started piling up. The cost to build a mass cremation system was too expensive and so they buried the animals in a landfill. Then the environmentalists were concerned about the effects of that on the environment - it was a good story. I hope to find it for you and post or something like it.

  81. Angelique says:

    The kitties may leave the feathers, but the doggies leave NOTHING when I give them a whole unplucked chicken, feets and all. Mmmmm, yummy fresh by products, just like nature intended.

  82. Angelique says:

    My understanding from a friend who works at a veterinary clinic is that “mass burial” really means “local landfill.”

  83. YaYa says:

    The animals will leave the Bile ducts and bile too {blech it green}. My cat would leave the wings and tails for sure and feet.
    He’d open the animals and eat “inside of” the hair/fur.
    Of course the more I tamed him {he was totally wild} the less he’d eat outside, but still had a habit now and then. {which seems scary now, he like the in the house stuff!}
    He liked the homemade wih some canned.
    He became a total Housecat and even slept with me. Was a “guard” cat and would growl with “things” that did not ‘belong there’ etc. He was Awesome.

    The Vet tech girls were Terrified of him due to his teeth and paws and size LOL
    *I* would have to go back to pick him up out of the kennels after his few surgeries {abcesses}, they would not bring him to me! :-D

    What a melt in your arms cat he was with me!
    Vet said he was part wild cat from his incisors alone.
    Had wispy peaks of fur on his ear tips too.

    Just seemed like a Great cat to me :-D

  84. martin says:

    This could be the prime time for someone to start a making pet food that utilizes only USDA inspected meats and products ( ? wondering if they really inspect squat). None of the B - C - D or F grade. Just the prime A+ grade.
    Sure it would triple in cost but I do believe most of us would rather pay for good quality A+ food rather than spend it in the vets office or at the pet cemetery.

    Now, the big question I ask myself:
    “isnt that what you thought you were buying 3 months ago” ?????

  85. mittens says:

    my semi feral torties eat the feathers off their pet toys….and i had a calico who ate a racoon skin cap she dragged out of a closed drawer and ripped to bits. call of the wild.

  86. Helen says:

    Martin, as far as I know, that is just what Evy has tried to do with Kumpi. And it costs $22 for four pounds of cat food. From everything I have read, it is worth it. Email Evy and ask her what’s in there. Her email is on the website.

  87. Kiki says:

    From the Humane Society Website:
    http://www.hsus.org/pets/pet_c....._body.html

    What is Rendering?

    Rendering factories process animal bodies (usually those of livestock but sometimes those of companion animals) into products such as tallow and fertilizer. Some pet caregivers, viewing their pet’s spirit as distinct from the body, choose to have their pet’s body rendered so the remains can be put to further use. Your local animal care and control agency or veterinarian should be able to advise you on the availability of this option in your community.

    Remember, regardless of which method you ultimately select to handle your pet’s body, your pet will always be close to your heart.

  88. lacy says:

    LorieVa
    Sorry this is totally off subject, but are you the same Lorie with Geisha? If so, have you heard from the vet who was getting California Natural and Wellness tested?? I am so curious because I was considering feeding CN canned since it is made at the south dakota plant, and supposedly that plant hasnt had recalls and natura is testing for melamine. But I would really like to know if she got those results.

  89. martin says:

    Thanks Helen.

    It would be worth it. Are you using Kumpi?

  90. Helen says:

    I know a cat who eats string. He has narrowly escaped death and surgery, as he will eat string, rubber bands, dental floss, or any stringy thing he finds in the garbage. Some children eat dirt. That does not make it all healthy as a PRIMARY food ingredient, and your cat, dog, or child does not obtain good nutrition from hair, fingernails, string, feet, beaks, feathers, dirt, feces, and raccoon skin. Angelique, since you give your dogs a whole chicken, they are getting the guts, meat, fat and all along with. Then the by products come out the other end. I am more annoyed (translation: OUTRAGED BEYOND REPAIR) at all these companies charging excessively high premium prices for food (including prescription food) that has no digestible meat in it and then telling us this hair, hooves, feathers, and poison infested grain sweepings are “complete and balanced nutrition” for our pets!

  91. YaYa says:

    One of my 1st Orientals years ago used to eat holes in one of my Wool blankets. Does this count for eating everything? LOL
    {on top of she was a Nut cat :-) }

    Actually she was what they call a “Wool Sucker”. An oddity for some cats.

  92. Helen says:

    Martin, I’m not, but I will be if anything changes about Natura. People like Kumpi so much it’s been referred to as a cult on the petfoodlist forum. LOL People can’t say enough nice stuff about it. I only said that because it sounds like something you would be interested in trying. There is a Kumpi for dogs and one for cats, both dry. Evy created the food so she would have something safe to feed her own pets. I emailed her some questions and she answered right back. I would not hesitate to try it, but I am happy with the dry right now because at least my little fuss-budget agreed to change dry foods. :)

  93. Zoe says:

    “What is Rendering?

    Rendering factories process animal bodies (usually those of livestock but sometimes those of companion animals) into products such as tallow and fertilizer. Some pet caregivers, viewing their pet’s spirit as distinct from the body, choose to have their pet’s body rendered so the remains can be put to further use. Your local animal care and control agency or veterinarian should be able to advise you on the availability of this option in your community.

    Remember, regardless of which method you ultimately select to handle your pet’s body, your pet will always be close to your heart.”

    So you can remember them every time you spread fertilizer on your lawn or burn a candle or use some soap (tallow) ? ewww! I certainly didn’t know that about rendering.

  94. Steve says:

    China says pet food ingredient chemical-free

    May 16, 2007

    SHANGHAI, China - China says checks on food exporters have turned up no sign of a chemical blamed for the deaths of cats and dogs in North America, and urged U.S. authorities to refrain from further action against Chinese producers.

    The government body responsible for overseeing food safety said it accompanied U.S. Food and Drug Administration inspectors on visits to two companies blamed for the chemical contamination.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18698701/

  95. straybaby says:

    i don’t know, not seeing many pet parents willing to render their pets body into pet food . . . .

  96. Helen says:

    Steve: Denial is good for dewallet.

  97. YaYa says:

    WoW, now I DO feel all safe and warm and cozy! The Chinese say——

    I expected Nothing less. Sorry I was wrong. But I Will Not Forget. For the REST of my Life! The SOB’s!

    Even if WE are Banned here at Itchmo. I Sure hope their Government Is READING!

  98. straybaby says:

    martin Says:

    martin, there are a handful of companies out there that do produce this type of food. also, certified organic pet foods may have to follow along. in certified organic, pet foods follow the same rules as people certified organic. the one downside i have seen though, is some are a bit grain heavy, imo. i’m guessing it may be partly do to making it still *affordable*

    for me, i make the food. the ultra premium brands that i would feed my pets cost the same or more than what i make for them.

  99. lainie says:

    When I Said By Products Werent The Problem I Meant Healthy Animal Parts Not Road Kill And Rotting Flesh Ppl. Even The Dogs And Cats That Leave Most Of Thr Kill For Us To Clean Up Have Ingested Some Fur And Feathers In Tearing Open Thr Dinner. My Cats Think A Mouse Is A Toy If 1 Has The Misfortune To Wander In. But I Was Talking Strays In The Street. Whn I Stated They Eat Thr Kill They Have No Human Supplyn Brkfast Lunch And Dinner. Where I Am All Animals Must Be Either Mass Cremated Or Individually And Know The Vet Tech Very Well There Is No Rendering Of Pet Corpses. The Fee To Dispose Of A Dead Animal Lazt Time I Had To Was $75.00 For My Husky 14yrz Ago Cant Imagine What Its Up To Now. And The Fines For Burying In Your Back Yard Are Also High. So Thr Are Some Places Doing The Right Thing By Our Pets. Or Trying To

  100. Kiki says:

    Yeah, in reality, the vets and humans society aren’t explicit in telling us how they dispose of pets - but they should be.

    Now if you go on the rendering association website, you will see a document that has a breakdown of stuff. Anything that is called meat is not swine, poultry, beef, lamb, etc…since all other rendered animal is explicit. Thus, meat must be road kill and pets. In the non-edible section, there is a notation that says that non-edibles go into pet food. It’s right there if you dig through it.

  101. ally says:

    Steve Says:
    May 16th, 2007 at 6:09 pm

    Yep.

    ally Says:
    May 16th, 2007 at 9:45 am:

    http://www.itchmo.com/read/rec.....6#comments

  102. Moony says:

    I don’t know where I read it, possibly ‘Catwatching’, but someone put forth the idea that cats actually think we’re such pathetic hunters that they’re ‘feeding’ us. :D My mother also swears that the vet they got their cat, who was a stray, from says that the cat actually brought a mouse in exchange for every single bowl of food she got.

    Since June 2005, I’ve had three animals euthanized - my horse, my small dog, and one of my cats. Only the horse went to a rendering plant (and yes, I did fill out paperwork for that), the other two went to a landfill. If you think about it, tho, what’s the difference between the dead pets and all the crap people throw away like chicken carcasses, which may or may not be filled up with antibiotics, etc, anyway…not to mention the prescription drugs that inevitably wind up there for lack of anywhere else to throw them away. I have to wonder about the companies who are asking us to do one or more things to ‘help’ the water, etc…are they also crusading against prescription drugs that go into the landfill, through the water systems, etc, too? Are they complaining about every sewer grate marked ‘flows to stream’ that happens to be in the middle of *a parking lot*? Or are they just asking people to do these things because its good PR and makes them look like a ‘green’ company?

  103. Kiki says:

    No, strays generally hang out behind restaurants and pick off the uneaten human food.

  104. Jenny Barkley says:

    Put cnn on now, it’s about importted food from China.

  105. Elaine Vigneault says:

    Just to be clear, you have more than these two options:
    1) Join a class action or
    2) Make a claim with Menu Foods.

    There are more options:
    1) You can tell Menu Foods you want to settle your claim without providing all the information they request. You can negotiate separately with Menu Foods
    2) You can negotiate with the pet food brand your pet ate instead of or in addition to Menu Foods
    3) You can offer your story and testimony to aid other class action suits (for research purposes etc) without joining a suit yourself
    4) You can sue Menu Foods and other brands on your own
    5) You can choose paths other than the legal and the financial paths: You can start up your own pet food company. You can promote or resell safe pet food brands. You can organize political action. You can investigate pet food manufacturers and report on them as a journalist…

  106. Kiki says:

    Go Lou!! Also Sanjay Gupta has a 2 part series on poisoned food this sat/sunday 8pm eastern (I am prety sure I got the date/time)..

  107. Genny says:

    Helen Says:

    May 16th, 2007 at 6:11 pm

    “Steve: Denial is good for dewallet.”

    Been waiting all day for one of these. ( ;

  108. Jenny Barkley says:

    Kiki
    Your right. I have to make supper for my babies, talk to you all later.

  109. Genny says:

    Martin,

    I started mine on KumpiKat a few weeks ago.

    Not to be too elementary, if you probably already know this, or *redundant* but be sure to gradually switch foods. Speaking from personal experience, it could save kitties from getting really sick and also save your budget.

  110. lainie says:

    Martin Go Check Out Spots Stew And Then Open A Can It Looks And Smells Like What They Say Is In It. I Just Got Some Vita Green Samples From Halo Pets. Along With The Samples They Sent Me A Reciepe For Spots Stew. Every Product They Make Is Supposed To Be Usda Grade A. My Dogs Unfortunately Cant Eat It (they Have Never Done Well On Human Food Tryd Many Times) And My Cats Wont They Eat Every Table Food I Cook But Will Only Eat 1 Cat Food. They Are 11 And 12 And Vry Set In Thr Ways So Unless It Gets Recalld Im Leaving Them Alone. But Check Out Halopets.com You May Find What Your Lookn For

  111. Steve says:

    Nothing to see here. Move along.

    China

  112. ann says:

    Here is a report detailing the amount of euthanasia fluid found in different brands of pet food. You need to scroll down to the topic….
    This Document is no longer on the FDA website (I couldn’t find it anyway….). The FDA has a current document stating that the euthanasia drud is probably from euthanized livestock and horses………I’ve given a burial to every horse that I have owned and passed away.

    www.fda.gov/cvm/FOI/DFreport.htm

    www.doggstuff.com/

  113. ann says:

    for some reason my e-mail is in cyper space again. Check out www.doggstuff.com for a link to levels of euthanasia fluid found in pet food.

  114. ann says:

    here is the link to the latter FDA document explainig why its even in there..

    http://www.fda.gov/cvm/FOI/DFreport.htm

  115. Kiki says:

    I though they already stopped horse meat from going in pet food?

  116. ann says:

    Private owners can call “removal” companies. What happens later is another story. In the 1970’s a law was passed banning the round up of mustangs for slaughter.

    Currently the sale of horsemeat in the US is illegal. But, there are 3 slaughter houses 1 I know is still in business, that slaughter horses for meat export overseas.

  117. ann says:

    The meat by the way is for people, not pet food. Its considered a delicacy. I have owned and bred throrughbreds for over 20 years, and the very thought of it makes me sick.

  118. YaYa says:

    Ann! That’s the deal I was trying to remember. The Horse meat goes mainly to France for Human consumption.

    I remember when I was a little kid, the “story” was Dog food was horse meat. {the stuff in the cans} I was Horrified!
    I know I’ve signed petitions as an Adult to stop the slaughter of horses and the killing of the American Wild Mustangs.
    But I knew somehow the French were getting our horse meat over there.

    Shows you how Laws go only so far. If they don’t cover EVERYTHING. The snakes will find a way.
    Thanks, I must be getting old {since this Food poisoning!}

  119. ann says:

    YaYa - hope you can return the favor someday (which I feel is soon) when memory retraction is just a memory….

    I know that there currently are bills in front of legislatures to close the slaughter houses down permanently. Sadly, the ugly side of this business is that alot of the horses are stolen and then sold to these “places.” Many racehorses end up here too. There was a champion thoroughbred named Exceller that was sold to Japan, and when his value as a stud was no more, he ended up at a Swedish slaughter house. WWW.excellerfund.org has the story. I cry everytime I read it.

  120. mittens says:

    the wool suckers and feather gnawers are actually obeying their genetic call on what the modern world has provided them instead of their ‘ natural /in the wild’ diet. my cat didn’t actually eat the racoon cap- she was rending and chewing as she would have done in the wild- as her ancesters did in the deserts of africa- to get at the inside goodies of the little varmits and baby birdies she’d be eating as nature made her, outside our industrialized world. those sharp little vampire fangs were made for rending through fur and feathers. this is part of the reason some now feel dry food should never be fed to cats- it’s the antithesis of how they are physically and genetically designed to eat. there are no cereal bowls and brown rice paddies in the desert.

    my cats aren’t allowed near string or anything that could damage their insides but they can rip up their toys to their heart’s delight.

    cats are known also for being particularly bad at watering themselves because in their past most of their water of necessity was derived from the animals they ate. all dry food diets to my understanding can lead to kidney problems no matter how pure organic or removed from chinese ingredients they are because the cat ends up not consuming enough water to hydrate itself adequetly and flush it’s system out. would you want to eat breakfast cereal with no milk for every meal? everyday?

  121. YaYa says:

    I know it a ways off Ann, but you’ve made me think, to find a place or way to bury my Horse in the future. I don’t want to even think what might happen if I don’t :-( The laws are so stiff about burials these days for something like that. And probably even in the “country” too.

    I’ve known quite a few people who’ve adopted retired race horses {TB and QH}, and they make the Nicest Horse to have.
    They Luv the attention. It’s the type they’ve rarely had being a “work horse”.

    Same with Greyhounds. Which will probably be the next dog *I* get.

    You are on the Ball here Girl! I don’t see, in the near future, the need to ‘remind’ You of anything :-D

    Thanks

  122. YaYa says:

    Mittens, Very Well explained!
    I’ve changed my whole way of thinking on the feeding of Indoor cats in particular, through this fiasco.
    And I will continue to share my rare bowl or cereal with my kitty, I eat the cereal and she get some of the milk :-)
    I also try to Not cook the heck out of the meats I’m feeding her now. {she won’t eat Raw!}

    Of course she started out as a stray, had to work for her food; now when she finds a very Rare mouse {1 a year maybe} she brings it to ME Alive! LOL
    Thanks

  123. Helen says:

    Steve: “These aren’t the plants you’re looking for”

  124. Lorie says:

    Lacy,

    I never heard back from her one way or another on the CN. Let me try and find out tomorrow for you. SOrry started to email you today at work but got side tracked.

  125. lacy says:

    Lorie
    Thank you soooo much for trying to find out. I really really appreciate it! :)

  126. lainie says:

    Martin I Had To Reply To A Link You Posted Yesterday About Dogs Being Eatin In China Its Been Known For Years By New Yorkers That Remember The First Wave Of Chinese Immigrants Opening Resturants Back In The 80z That Were Soon Closed By The Dozon For Serving Dog Meat And Cat Meat. A Stray Dog Is A Rare Site Now And The Only Stray Cats Are The Extremely Feral That No One Can Get Near. Gave A Neighbor A Ride There Was A Pigeon In The Street His Reply Was Hit It They Make Good Stew For Dinner . This Remark Turnd My Stomache But Other Things That Have Been Seen Where I Live Are Much Worse. I Live In The Heart Of New Yorks New China Town. Have Watchd The Changes And The Animal Population Change Dramatically. Therez Alot Less Squiralls Too. I Do Know Alot That Own Dogs But Alot More Dont And Had A 13yr Old Korean Boy Tell My Son That Cats Are Bad Luck Compounded By The Fact That I Have A Black Cat Lol Needless To Say My Son Laughed @ This

  127. martin says:

    Helen, Genny, Lainie, (and the rest)

    Thanks for the advise. You all are the best! Through all this I cant imagine not having Itchmo or all of you out there. Everyone is here to help everyone else. That’s what it’s all about! Many friends will be made here I’m sure. I just wish it was us all discussing something like ingrown toe nails or something,..not this.

  128. martin says:

    lainie,

    I don’t think I can say what I think of those who do this. It is sick. The photo on the link I looked at is burned in my mind & has bothered me all day. Some other cultures obviously don’t have the compassion for companion animals as many of us do. It’s a sad case for them as they will never know the unconditional love as we do.

  129. Genny says:

    Martin,

    Ditto, ditto! ouch on those toe nails. they’re no fun. i opt for all sitting around a few pizzas showing pics of our healthy babies, bragging on which is the cutest, smartest, etc.

  130. Genny says:

    To all the comedians here - Thanks for the daily dose of humor! Please keep it coming…….!

  131. Leslie k says:

    Mandy- My cats are picky also. Would never eat canned only dry. They are eating Wellness, Cal natural & Canidae dry [mixed]. Also homemade wet food. They love it ! I made them turkey & salmon soup w/dried cherries, apples, carrots & gr beans . Put in a little brown rice & flax seed for fiber & pureed it when it cooled.They also like sweet potatoes and zuchini. Herring has been a favorite. It’s not hard. Just go heavy on the meat & add bone meal or clean oven dried egg shells ground. Also a good us made multi vitamin.

  132. nancy says:

    “Moony Says:

    May 16th, 2007 at 6:20 pm
    I don’t know where I read it, possibly ‘Catwatching’, but someone put forth the idea that cats actually think we’re such pathetic hunters that they’re ‘feeding’ us. :D My mother also swears that the vet they got their cat, who was a stray, from says that the cat actually brought a mouse in exchange for every single bowl of food she got.”

    My cat Buster definitely is feeding us—he’s brought home mice and actually put them in the food dish! He also brings in small lizards, completely unharmed, for the other cats to play with. :)

  133. martin says:

    Genny,

    Me too! That day will come soon I hope. I’d much rather be dealing with an ingrown that this. It would be a much more pleasant experience for sure.

  134. Mandy says:

    Hey Leslie k, would you believe my older cat actually doesn’t care for fish? Her favorite food is chicken. She’s so picky even with the people food she eats. She won’t eat canned at all only dry, so I got her some new dry food that’s on the safe list. She doesn’t want it.

    When I mixed the new food with the old food, she sat there and picked out the old food from among the new food! I put in bits of bacon which she likes in the new food, she wouldn’t touch it. I coated the new food with bacon grease. She wouldn’t touch it.

    The problem is she’s eleven years old and she doesn’t like any change at ALL. Not just with her food but in her life period. She is so stubborn.

    My younger cat who is only two, loves the new food. I’ve had no problems with him.

    I may have to consider yours and others recipes for home made food and talk to our vet about it. This whole thing is just driving me crazy.

  135. Patricia says:

    Martin -
    I’ve got 2 “bag & can” house cats who have been on a mix of 3 dry foods - EVO (Natura), Flint River Ranch & Kumpi since mid-March. Also switched treat moist food from Fancy Feast (yeah, they liked the ones with gluten as the 3rd ingredient) to Sheba domes. Glossier coats now. Ordered some Wildkitty raw out of Maine, but getting them onto that is going to be a slow process.
    The Maltese is still doing great on FargoFarMore raw. In fact by her own choice she is eating hardly any dry, but maintaining her weight.
    Ck out wildkittycatfood.com. The food is organically sterilized using Ultra-High Pressure. Her food also passed life-stages feeding trials at UC Davis.
    Now if I could just get the cats out of the bags (and cans)!

  136. Mandy says:

    Hooray! My older cat finally ate a little of her new food! Just two or three pieces, but it’s a start right?

  137. LorieVA says:

    Okay my husband came home from work yesterday and said that his co-worker was getting kitten this weekend, he told her to be careful what she bought to feed it and she looked at him like he was crazy…………………….

  138. Karen V says:

    LorieVA

    Did you point them to this website?

  139. seagullist says:

    I had to put down my beautiful Rott/Shepherd two weeks ago. She had 5 inoperable lymphoma sarcomas on her liver and was bleeding into the abdominal cavity. Her spleen was also suspect. In local news this evening, the commentator talked about the offer of Menu Foods to settle with customers of recalled dog food. He said that he had found that you had to have the cans or labels and/or possibly the grocery store receipts. I am not necessarily linking my dog’s condition with Menu Foods, but I spent a lot of money with the vet in April because the dog was demonstrating all of the symptoms of eating the tainted foods. Four days before my beloved dog had to be put down, my vet called and gave me the results of her urine test which indicated that she did not have kidney failure. From that point on, my dog became steadily worse. Does anyone know if the tainted dog food could cause liver tumors?

    Beyond that, I feel that $300 on lab tests and vet fees were part of a process of elimination associated with the dog food scare. Turns out I have a few grocery receipts proving that I purchased Pet Pride canned dog food (produced by Menu Foods) and it was given to the dog (1/2 can over her Purina Little Bits dry dog food) for most of her 12 years. I haven’t heard that the tainted dog food causes liver tumors, but have to admit that I am suspicious that down the line, we may hear that it did. The emergency care vet said she could not rule it out because they have just scratched the surface in this investigation. Regardless, I’m wondering if Menu Foods would be responsible enough to admit that because of the recall, many pet owners endured high vet & lab test costs, whether positive or negative. I feel that Menu Foods should pay those costs for owners who needed to rule out effects of tainted dog food.

    If anyone cares to comment on my questions, I’d sure appreciate it. This dog is hard to get over for me and if nothing else, it helps to be informed and educated.

  140. Mandy says:

    seagullist I am so very sorry to hear about your dog. My family had to put down our dog a few years ago. It’s always so hard to do, even if it is to relieve their suffering. *Hugs.*

  141. seagullist says:

    Mandy, thanks so much for your kind words. I miss my dog so much because she was such a loyal and constant companion. She always watched for me in a window near the entrance to my home. When I saw her in the window, I knew for sure that no one had broken into my house. I always said, “Who would break into a house with a large Rottweiler/Shepherd barking at the window!” I should have named her Velcro because she walked along side of me everywhere I went in the house, upstairs, downstairs, kitchen to the laundry room, etc. She was such an attentive dog and seemed to sense my every emotion. So you can understand the extra tough time I’m going through. My home feels so empty without her now.

    I’m checking out dogs for down the road and doing a lot of reading. A lot of grieving articles say its best not to get a dog that looks just like the dog you lost. In fact, they recommend getting an entire different breed. And its best not to get a dog too soon after losing your pet for fear of building a resentment toward a new pet for trying to take the place of your former dog. Of course, no dog will ever replace my Rott/Shep but surely, a new bond will materialize with another dog down the road.

    Hugs back to you Mandy … you have a very kind heart.


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