Texas Lab Claims Acetaminophen In Mixed Dog Food
A Texas lab reports that a pet food sample that included a composite of two different dry dog foods has tested positive for acetaminophen. The sample was sent to Expertox, last month to be tested for any toxins.
Expertox says the results were inconclusive because the sample was sent to the lab in a Ziploc bag. Internet reports say that the two formulas that were tested were from Canidae. The lab cannot verify the sample received is the actual product claimed unless the sample is received in an unopened, sealed, untampered can or bag.
Controversy is brewing over the test results as the best buy dates mentioned in the test report do not exist, according to Canidae. According to Internet reports, the two Canidae dry dog foods that were included in the positive sample are:
1) Canidae All Life Stages Dry Dog Food — best by date RM 7/7/07, use by 7/7/08
2) Canidae All Life Stages Lamb and Rice Formula Dry Dog Food — best by date RM 7/6/07, use by 7/6/08.
(Note: Original Internet reports claimed the best by dates were in July, but now there are new reports claiming that the best by dates of the tested food are from a June lot.)
Neither of these dog foods have been recalled.
It is still uncertain which food or if both of the dry dog foods blamed contains acetaminophen.
Here is the test result.
September 5th, 2007 at 12:24 am
So does this mean that this could still be in a lot of pet foods? Is it all going to start again? IF this lab tested it shouldn’t the FDA get a sample to test or do they only test the bags and nothing more. Who makes this band anyway? I wonder if they will post that there is something wrong with their food now or pretend it is all okay.
It is so upsetting to here this crap is still out there in our pet food.
September 5th, 2007 at 12:27 am
If someone has this stuff & doesn’t have the money to have it tested I will pitch in some to help pay for testing. Imo we are going to keep having trouble with pet food because we are up against big money & we have to keep fighting them. I can’t even find Candice in my area. Can someone tell me where I could look for it with these dates.
September 5th, 2007 at 12:49 am
“Canidae says none of their products match the above date codes.”
Except the bag sitting in my storage area waiting to be opened.
(Well, it won’t be…)
September 5th, 2007 at 1:50 am
Jenny,
I understand there are two unopened bags of this stuff available for testing. One each of the varieties that made up the composite. I’ve generally made it a policy not to pay for other people’s tests, mainly because I can’t afford to do it for everyone and I’d end up being the bad guy if I offered to pay for some and not others.
On this round I’m making an exception and have offered to chip in $100 toward having the unopened bags tested. I haven’t checked with the lab yet, but I don’t anticipate a problem making a credit card payment over the phone toward the total.
If you or anyone else wants to help out on this one, drop me an email from the contact information on my site and we’ll figure something out.
It’s my understanding this isn’t something left over from the recall period, but is currently being marketed and sold to pet owners. The threat appears to be real and our pets are still very much in harm’s way. Dogs can tolerate acetaminophen to some extent, but if someone’s cat ate out of the dog’s dish, you can kiss kitty goodbye. I don’t know how long acetaminophen can be fed to dogs before it kills them, but I wouldn’t want to find out the hard way.
Anyone who isn’t mad enough to do something yet better start thinking about getting that way, or else buy a shovel and dig a hole.
September 5th, 2007 at 2:12 am
If you suspect the dog is feeling unwell from a food and it’s already opened, what recourse does one have?
Except that you stop feeding the food.
Which I guess is enough.
Good luck with that. How much is testing??????
September 5th, 2007 at 2:52 am
Don I sent you an e-mail on your contact info. I’m not that good on a computer so if I messed that up let me know & I will resend in the morning.
Even if all these different foods don’t kill the dogs or cats we don’t know what damage it is doing to them & how long they will live.
September 5th, 2007 at 3:21 am
Could someone please post the ingredients in both products. It would be helpful to compare ingredients lists as far as supplements and meats with other brands.
September 5th, 2007 at 3:26 am
Could someone please list ingredients for both products. Unable to find on their site.
September 5th, 2007 at 3:38 am
Jenny,
I don’t see anything in my inbox. Copy and paste:
don-earl@waypoint.com
in the send to box of whatever email program you use.
September 5th, 2007 at 3:48 am
The ingredient lists for Canidae and Felidae are listed in detail on the company’s website: http://www.canidae.com
I’ve fed Canidae to my GSD and ASD for almost a decade, and both dogs are large, healthy, active, and OLD. There’s no corn, wheat, soy, or any extraneous stuff in their foods, they produce their food at their own facilities. They don’t import ingredients from outside the country. Of course I’m somewhat concerned about this report, but then again, is this the same Texas lab which found Acetaminophen in another brand a few months ago, and no other lab could replicate it?
September 5th, 2007 at 4:26 am
Sorry for duplication earlier. The ingredient list didn’t come up on my computer.
Check the ingredient profile with other brands that produced the same lab result. Any common ingredients, other than meat?
Leigh-Ann: it doesn’t matter if the ingredients are from the US or not. The only thing that matters is if these companies test for toxins that have shown up on lab tests. Any one of them that ignores the mere possibility of acetaminophen is whistling in the dark in my book.
September 5th, 2007 at 7:02 am
We need to get to the bottom of this. Is acetaminophen what’s killing our pets? What amounts of it are in the food?
Don, I’ll help with the testing. Will send email.
September 5th, 2007 at 8:01 am
Even if all the ingredients are from the US, where are the vitamins or the premix made? I recently read an article where the owner or CEO of a commercial pf company said that most all vitamins have to be purchased from China…….so all I ask is whether or not the vitamins are from China & have they been tested before they go into the food.
All we need is a simple yes or no…….that goes for any pf company.
Why is there so much confusion over the best buy date???????
September 5th, 2007 at 8:11 am
MANY of us have suspected all along that we don’t have the full story about the contaminants in the pfs. I don’t think this is going to be an isolated incident.
BTW, there have been very reasonable explanations about why Expertox has found substances that other labs haven’t. That, to me, is not a concern. There are certainly ways to “not find” substances if that’s your goal. And how many of the labs are truly INDEPENDENT?
More questions than answers right now . . .
September 5th, 2007 at 8:37 am
Don i hope you have my e-mail now. If I figured this out right it went into Microsoft outlook instead of Yahoo. If you didn’t get it let me know but it says that I have it sent now at 8:01. This has happend to me before & that is where I found my e-mail. Sometimes i get mad at myself.
September 5th, 2007 at 8:39 am
I know that a lot of vitamin pre-mix comes from BASF. I don’t know from what countries they source their individual ingredients.
Here’s an interesting look at the vitamin and vitamin pre-mix industry! Scandal, scandal, scandal!
From NY Times:
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/f.....nted=print
September 5th, 2007 at 9:02 am
Note to PF compainies and FDA:
It’s the VITAMINS, stupid.
September 5th, 2007 at 9:14 am
OMG! I thought I had finally found a dry mix to mix with the food I prepare for my dogs now that I don’t feed cans! I have it ordered through the internet because no stores around here sell it. NOW its contaminated too????? I have seven furbabies and this makes me mad as hell!
September 5th, 2007 at 10:02 am
I cant even believe this. My cats eat felidae, and my moms dog eats canidae. They are all acting normal, but I took everyone off the food last night when i learned of this. I cook my cats dinner, but does anyone have an idea of what i should give them as a substitute for dry food, to leave out during the day?
September 5th, 2007 at 10:14 am
Leigh-Ann…..part of the problem is that Canidae does not have their own production plant. They tell that to people but their dry food is made by Pied Piper in Texas. They tried for a long time to hide that and will still lie to people about it if they can get away with it.
If they lie about one thing that is so important what else will they lie about? It is just wrong to try and look like something you are not. Even Solid Gold admitted to having their dry made by Diamond Pet Food manufacturing and I admire them for that.
September 5th, 2007 at 10:17 am
nikki,
Don’t mean to sound flippant, but probably NOT something that’s made by the US pet food industry.
Those companies and the FDA have poisoned the food supply.
September 5th, 2007 at 10:26 am
This is very This is very irresponsible of Expertox. I’ve been here since the beginning of all the recalls and support Itchmo 100%. You more than likely saved my dogs and for that I will be ever grateful. However, this report from Expertox from an unknown source in an unmarked bag (ziplock) is a he said she said scenario. Without it coming from an unopend and properly sealed bag of Canidae, I don’t believe it. I feed my dogs a cycle of Canidae wet and Merrick wet/dry but I’ll only be using Merrick until this is confirmed or disproved.
I can’t help but to think of the past screw up by this lab. Before jumping on this report and hundreds if not thousands of you sending in samples, just think about this, Expertox is a business. Do a bit of research and start at http://www.expertox.com/ and then do a bit more googling on this company.
September 5th, 2007 at 10:39 am
Leigh-Ann writes, “is this the same Texas lab which found Acetaminophen in another brand a few months ago, and no other lab could replicate it?”
To the best of my knowledge, no other lab or the FDA tried to replicate anything. Pulling a different sample, using different test equipment, different test senitivity, etc., doesn’t REPLICATE - it CONFUSES.
September 5th, 2007 at 10:44 am
SO. Now Canidae!!! I stopped supplementing my 4 dogs home cooked with occasional Canidae dry 2 months ago. (in the mornings when i was in a hurry). My cats are getting occasional dry Felidae and wet Felidae when I am out of their home cooking and pressed for time (I have to be at work at 6AM.) SO NOW i will take the home cooking one step furthur and make a compete commitment to it. This forces my hand and we now have no choice. Just as I always feared……..NO COMMERCIAL PET FOOD CAN WE DEPEND ON. And as far as Merrick goes, what about those dog tags found in the cans of Dog food a few years ago? That says alot.
September 5th, 2007 at 10:51 am
I have to agree with Randy. Expertox is a business, but even their test results say that the test results were inconclusive. Haven’t they made these claims before and nobody could duplicate the test. Reputable sources such as UC Davis have tested other foods that Expertox have found acetaminophen in and have found nothing. Why would they test two foods that were mixed together? Why is it unclear as to which date code that the food is from? This food was in a ziploc bag. Who knows what could have happened to it. Plus, one has to wonder why a dog food company would put Tylenol in pet food. What benefit would that be to them??? Not very cost effective. I think that there are a lot of holes in this story. I have fed Canidae for years and am not about to stop because of one inconsistent claim.
September 5th, 2007 at 10:54 am
According to this report, what we have is a mixed sample in an unmarked Ziplock bag. We don’t know that’s even Canidae, folks, much less whether the acetaminophen was in the food prior to opening the original packaging. There was a previous report several weeks back that was nearly identical to this one, except a different brand was involved, and that died away so quickly that it’s hard to hold on to the idea that there was ever any there there.
Also, the original contamination, using melamine to fake wheat or rice protein concentrate, originated in the fact that using melamine in plain ground wheat is much cheaper than using real wheat gluten or real rice protein concentrate. Acetaminophen is relatively expensive; the motivation for using melamine simply doesn’t apply here. Accidental cross-contamination also seems dubious: It’s not theoretically impossible for the same machines to be used to make pills and to make kibble, at least not as far as I know, but drug manufacturing facilities do actually get inspected and are genuinely highly regulated. Like the small number of companies producing pet food in factories that mainly make human food and are therefore USDA-inspected, any pet food company that was doing this would be bragging about it.
So you pretty much wind up with the only explanation being unmotivated, active malice–someone deliberately poisoning the pet food, for the purpose of killing pets. Someone who has access to the (different, separate) facilities manufacturing two different, relatively high-end brands.
Or, alternatively, you’ve got someone intentionally exploiting the current, entirely justified, fear and concern surrounding pet food, in order to scare the pet owners some more and watch them go into a frenzy.
We’ve got (allegedly) a mixed sample in an unmarked Ziplock bag? And Expertox releases the results as if they meant something? And the “Best by” dates on the affected bags keeps changing? Why is that, I wonder?
September 5th, 2007 at 11:16 am
I first read in the forums here about Canidae testing positive on Aug. 24. But the lab report says “Date Recieved 08/27/07, Date Reported 09/04/07″. Can someone please explain?
September 5th, 2007 at 11:28 am
Terri- That would be yet another inconsistency in this story. Lets use our brains here people. Anybody can start a blog and claim anything they want.
September 5th, 2007 at 11:32 am
The thing you need to know about pet food manufacturers is that they do very little testing. That’s why the recall happened.
What testing they DO perform is based on the last problem that occurred, not what the next toxin may be.
This is NOT an industry that understands risk management or forward thinking. They don’t examine their supply chains, analyze the risks, and create QA procedures.
Whatever you’re feeding, call the company and ask lots of questions. Ask what tests they perform, at what stage of the process, what are the detection levels. Do they test for acetaminophen? What about dioxin? When did they begin testing? Ask to speak to their QA Manager or their Test Supervisor.
If they can answer all your questions with no attitude, come back here and let us know.
But if they say “we don’t test for THAT because it’s not supposed to be there”, “we don’t have a QA manager”, “maybe you should just make your own food”, “we don’t know because our food is made by XXX”, “sorry, that information is proprietary” . . . . .
Well, just let us know WHAT they say.
Surely there must be ONE respectable PF company in the USA.
September 5th, 2007 at 11:41 am
5CatMom, Perfectly said!
September 5th, 2007 at 11:44 am
Until INDEPENDENT testing is done on all food to find the toxins, both the stocks of “suspected” poison food that many still have from when this started, 6 months ago and foods STILL not recalled though reported to kill, well, who the fark knows what is in the food? A lot of companies are not even sure WHO makes the food for their brand or what goes into it before they slap a label on it, and apparently don’t care.
The pet food companies and the PFI are sure aware enough of the problems to send in trolls, right? Here and on other sites the trolls are slithering out from under rocks to plead for the jobs of Menu Foods workers and say HOW MUCH they LOVE any food mentioned by brand.
Almost makes me think we might be on the right track with testing, in fact it DOES make me think the testing bugs the crap out of the PFI.
Given the trolls, the lack of vet bills being paid, the lies and no apology policy and so many other things, I would not trust ANY commercial food but hey, as Don says, as long as you keep a shovel handy , feed what you want.
September 5th, 2007 at 11:56 am
Has ANY pet food company said here is the PROOF, we have NOTHING to hide Expertox can test ANY of our food, buy it from a store anywhere or test the stocks of “suspected ” poison food that everyone has stockpiled and if POISON is found we will PAY ALL VET BILL CLAIMS, INCLUDING CONTINUING CARE FOR SURVIVORS and publicly admit the numbers of pets killed and then publicly apologize for the cover up?
No, they have NOT because they KNOW how bad the death toll really is, how many are STILL dying and how many POISONS are STILL in the food.
Testing scares them and it should because the truth is coming for them and every single day that they continue to lie and cover up is going to cost them.
September 5th, 2007 at 12:03 pm
I’m glad Menu is losing their behinds and want the PFI to step up but some of you people have gone off the deep end. Everything you read on the internet is true? Now dog tags in Merrick, lmao. You need to take a breath and realize this is a mixed sample in a ziplock. The competition would never think to send a laced sample of their competitors dog food in for this very reason.
Listen, I’m not defending anyone or anything in the PFI, they need to step up but this is nothing short of tabloid rumors. I love my kids (furry ones) but I think people need to start thinking for themselves and realize that this kind news released from this lab is just irresponsible of them.
@E. Hamilton, just because one person speaks with a level head does not mean he is a troll. I’m sure the MF trolls are out there but not everyone is a troll who has a differing opinion than yours.
September 5th, 2007 at 12:12 pm
I don’t know what to think. I have two dogs still getting Canidae ALS & Timberwolf mixed, and the third is off Canidae and totally on TWO. I switched to Canidae when this whole mess started because I consistently read good things about it and didn’t hear of any problems. Over and over I saw people recommending it as safe, and still do. With all the inconsistencies in this story, I have to wonder about trolls setting out to go after one food that has seemingly avoided being hit by the recalls.
But still I will check the dates on the bag when I get home and just may feed TWO until this is cleared up or confirmed by duplicate testing.
September 5th, 2007 at 12:17 pm
If the PFI or the pet food companies gave a pink rats a$$ about the truth they could have started telling it a looong loong time ago, instead of covering up.
Yeah, there are trolls , or shills, if that is preferred and it is an “open secret” who some of them are and there is a “little surprise ” in the works for them and their employers.
September 5th, 2007 at 12:23 pm
Six months into this since the recalls started and almost a year since the mass POISONING started and has ANY pet food company done the right thing?
Has ANY pet food company spent one TENTH of the advertising budget on doing what it is going to take to get this SOLVED?
Testing and truth is the only way and THEY KNOW THIS!!
No, but they sure are paying the trolls.
September 5th, 2007 at 12:28 pm
Here’s a thought. Let’s have a PF industry STAND DOWN for a few days.
Each licensed PF company, feed mill, distributor, Wally World, and all who profit from the sale of pet food, would select 6 cans or bags from their inventory and send the food off to any lab that is certified to test 1ppm.
Have the labs runs lots of tests. Test for acetaminophen, cyanuric acid, melamine, melamine analogs, aminopterin, dixon, pentobarbital, propylene glycol, salmonella, DL-Methionine, endotoxin, mycotoxin, acrylamide — all the bad stuff.
Also test for the protein, fats, carbs, vitamins and minerals that SHOULD be in there.
Let’s find out if we’re buying pet food or toxic stew.
What do you think pet food companies?
Want to do some REAL testing?
September 5th, 2007 at 12:37 pm
Louie, good idea, BUT trust the PF company to pick the 6 cans or bags?, NAH, not so much.
And PULL every single TV ad for pet food OFF the air until, well until the truth clears the air a bit.
Testing labs in OTHER countries are quite capable of testing pet food and might be eager to give volume discounts, in particular those countries who have a lot of pet deaths due to imported US pet food. Food for thought, if not for pets that you want to keep alive.
September 5th, 2007 at 12:40 pm
E.H. - good to see you back! You’re comments are right on and bear repeating:
‘Has ANY pet food company said here is the PROOF, we have NOTHING to hide Expertox can test ANY of our food, buy it from a store anywhere or test the stocks of “suspected †poison food that everyone has stockpiled and if POISON is found we will PAY ALL VET BILL CLAIMS, INCLUDING CONTINUING CARE FOR SURVIVORS and publicly admit the numbers of pets killed and then publicly apologize for the cover up?
No, they have NOT because they KNOW how bad the death toll really is, how many are STILL dying and how many POISONS are STILL in the food.
Testing scares them and it should because the truth is coming for them and every single day that they continue to lie and cover up is going to cost them.’
Step up, pet food manufacturers! If your food is clean, PROVE IT! If you can’t/won’t, we’ll know you’re hiding an ugly truth and your future will mirror that of Menu Foods, Inc.
Don’t you get it?! We WANT to trust you! The first company that regains our faith will have pet owners FLOCKING to purchase its products! Natural Balance’s posting of test results is a start, but it’s not enough.
Acknowledge the numbers of dead, show them and their owners some respect and compassion, admit your role in this terrible affair, pay for the damages, and prove your foods are safe. You want to survive and be profitable - there’s your business plan, spelled out nice and neat for you.
September 5th, 2007 at 12:52 pm
Randy,
Expertox did not release the lab report.
The person(s) who ordered the testing and paid the bill released the lab report.
September 5th, 2007 at 12:54 pm
On Aug 24th they received the first positive test result, but didn’t know if it was in the Canidae or the California Natural. On Aug 27th they tested the samples separately (the 8-27 ‘received’ date) , and on the 28th or 29th reported that the Canidae was the sample that tested positive, and faxed the results to the owner. Because those results were not legible on the fax, on Sep 4th they were emailed to the owner. Hence the 9-4 ‘reported’ date.
September 5th, 2007 at 12:57 pm
E.,
You’re right. LOL, we’d have to stand over them.
September 5th, 2007 at 1:10 pm
So funny (sad funny) to read Randy’s attitude and some others who seem to be defending the pet food industry folks. Their ‘cool and level headed comments’ really seem cold and uncaring.
Expertox is a lab whose results are honored by a court of law - that is good enough for me. The person who sent them the food for testing was just trying to make sure their dog was safe in what they chose to feed. Not everyone is computer savvy or has time. It is easy for details to get lost in translation.
What is not lost is that the brand name CANIDAE did specifically test positive for acetaminophen. I cannot believe memories are so short as to forget the absolute panic that enveloped everyone when the recalls first started. I would rather see an over cautious consumer than people badgering the ones who had the Canidae tested and made themselves this vulnerable.
Donna had been there and done that with Natura. Anyone following this knows that trying to cast a shadow of doubt on Expertox or Accutrace is a dead giveaway that you are not in the loop of knowing the difference between a forensics laboratory and UC Davis and Midwest Labs.
Good try friends of Canidae. I know this must be really hard to deal with, but lets put ego aside and keep the focus on making sure our pets are eating safe. Woe to anyone who defends any product that ends up hurting a dog or a cat in the name of ‘brand’ or money.
September 5th, 2007 at 1:13 pm
Lets remember that you don’t know theres a problem with dry food until you open the bag & either see something wrong or your pet has a problem with it. Once the bag is opened,the lab says it came opened or in a ziploc bag to show that only the word of the person requesting the test tells them what it is. This is not to cast doubt,but to protect themselves legally.My test results say the same thing.I don’t know about the rest of you but saying you found no acet before running the test pretty much convinces me you don’t want to find it.If Expertox had anything to hide;why did they offer to allow the FDA to rerun the tests there under supervision ?That would be same equip,parameters & food. Would have given diffinitive answers.No pf co or the FDA took them up on it. Wonder why ?
September 5th, 2007 at 1:15 pm
Every ExperTox report you see means ONE thing , for sure, SOMEBODY knows how to pay the bill and it aint the pet food companies or the PFI now is it?
As for being posted on the internet and thus subject to the doubts of the shills, well where the fark is it going to get some EXPOSURE? The mainstream media that has been screwing over pets and pet parents for lo these MANY months?
That is real funny, that one is!
The shills are sure posting about their happy healthy pets and the BRAND on the very internet that they tell you not to trust-reminds me an awful lot of the TV ads for pet food I keep seeing, you know the ones. Paid for with money that is NOT paying the vet bills and the care for surviving pets, THOSE ADS!
September 5th, 2007 at 1:20 pm
ExperTox is a fully certified laboratory. Their results are accepted in court. The FDA revealed during the Congressional hearings this summer that they accept the results provided by companies even when the labs are uncertified. (And the last time I checked, pet food companies are businesses, too.) Personally, I would trust a certified independent lab, over these labs with contracts to pet food companies. I contacted a pet food company when my cat got sick. After two months of run-around and after her death, they have told me to open the container, pour one cup of food into a plastic bag, and they will send me a UPS call tag. I have not opened that bag. I have not received the call tag, which they supposed have already sent. IMO, these companies are hoping it will blow over and we’ll all get on to something else.
And if I sent them their baggie, what would happen? They want me to violate chain of custody.
September 5th, 2007 at 1:25 pm
[…] comes to you when called.Sign up for our daily email digest or subscribe in a RSS reader.Expertox, a Texas lab, claimed they found acetaminophen in a mixed sample of two different dry dog foods. Internet reports claim that the two dog foods […]
September 5th, 2007 at 1:26 pm
To Anonymous, I’m not defending anyone. Do you have comprehension difficulties? I even said I’m holding off on feeding Canidae to my dogs in my post above. I love my kids and if you can’t see that in my posts then it’s you that have an attitude towards what is fact. All I was saying is this certainly isn’t the smoking gun that started the recalls. I’m done with this thread, all I tried to do was point out what should have been obvious, mixed food in a ziplock.
I understand what it is to lose a pet, I lost my girlie (chow) last year to an unknown reason, maybe dog food but I have no hard proof. That’s why I started home cooking for the kids but this thread is full of irrational accusations. If the sample had come in a Canidae package my cans would be in the garbage. I have literally hand fed my 17yr old Laso, who is an epileptic, for the past year, so don’t tell me I don’t love my kids or that my attitude is defending the PFI because you couldn’t be more wrong.
September 5th, 2007 at 1:26 pm
Have you noticed, I have, that the FDA and the vets and the PFI and the ENTIRE pet food industry has done NOTHING, not a single thing to count the surviving pets suffering from kidney damage or the staggering costs in dollars to pet parents from this disaster?
Pay for POISON pet food, fraudulently labeled as premium, pay vet bills, pay for cremation or burial, pay for ongoing care for sick pets AND THEN PAY FOR TESTING and get ATTACKED for it?
Oh yeah, this is sure a shining moment for a Us citizen aint it?
PS, I am a whole lot happier with China executing a few and arresting others and throwing open the factory doors for inspection than I am with THIS country’s NON RESPONSE and cover up. China is doing MORE than the US to make it right. A proud day indeed, hah!
September 5th, 2007 at 1:28 pm
Well, even Itchmo is dropping the ball imho as well. His cover story on this lends itself to ridiculing the results. His statement that Expertox could not verify if it was the Canidae or not - and then not going on to state that Expertox DID indeed conclusively find that the Canidae brand tested positive for acetaminophen - well, Itchmo, what is up with that?
And every test always has that confidentiality issue - why make it seem like this is a different case for this test? How about a bit less bias? You have the phone number to reach the person this happened to - why aren’t you finding out from them more details about threatened lawsuits, etc?
ITCHMO ADMIN: YeahRight, we did contact Mary, a woman who originally posted about Expertox’s results. She is a friend of the woman who sent in the mixed sample. Mary declined to give us the woman’s contact information.
September 5th, 2007 at 1:32 pm
Honestly I would be skeptical no matter what brand of dog food this is, or is claimed to be. This is just from a scientific perspective — the parameters here open up a whole can of worms for error. The food was sent in a ziploc bag, not in its original packaging. It’s a mix of two different food samples, so we don’t know if neither, one, or both is the offender.
If you’ve got an unopened bag matching any of these dates, I would not feed it just in case. However maybe you could send that to be tested instead for more definitive results.
September 5th, 2007 at 1:59 pm
Using ANY commercial pet food is taking a hell of a risk at this point ,people are free to do whatever makes them happy but if the dog or cat keels over or requires expensive care well, it won’t be because _I_ said a brand or pet food could be trusted.
I encourage anyone who is feeding ANY commercial pet food to know the real name and correct address for ANYONE recommending that food because you may need that info real badly at some point!
Trusting the wrong folks is what got a lot of pets dead or suffering and things are STILL the same now!
Unless your vet is willing to put it in a legal contract that they will treat your pet for free if damage occurs then I would not even trust a vet to say what food is safe.
September 5th, 2007 at 2:14 pm
I offered to help pay for the tests because it is being tested by Expertox.No i’m not rich or even well off & I don’t yet know if they need help yet but I do know if your hurting for money ever little bit helps. Most of us heard the hearings the FDA had & know that they would not tell us all the names of the toxins they found & still haven’t. Expertox tested for a lot more toxins that the other labs tested for & would test for people that other labs would not. Expertox also tested at lower detection levels. Expertox did not release to the public the results Don’s site did, which is his right & I for one am glad he did. Any information to help save our babies imo is good. Expertox is FDA approved.
I remember the posts back not long after all this started when people would put in a zip lock bag the different foods they where using & pay for only 1 test. They then would go out & only buy that food & Lot #, then after all that food was gone do it again. If you have been on here for a long time think back & you will remember that too. I never trusted the food that way but if money was an issue (as it is for most of us) that was a way of trying to protect their babies & their right to do. I can only guess that some people are still doing this.
Trolls, I didn’t even know what that meant until a little while back but they are on here. EVERYBODY including me has the right to disagree with what anyone says. If you realy read the posts for awhile it doesn’t take much of brain to figure out who most of them are. They must not get paid very much. H!!! some of their posts sounded just like the answers you would get from the pet food people.
I home cook for my dogs & my cat is now 99% home feed. hope to say next week 100%. I buy Kumpi food not because I am recomending it, I don’t recomend any pfi food. I buy it because it was Expertox tested by 1 of the bloggers on here & since then she has been putting the test on her site. I had to have something while I learned to cook for them & get them changed over. I will be going into the hospital again & I always want to have something for them to eat in case I get into trouble & can’t cook. No ofence ment to the owner, I like her but I just trust the food I buy & cook more & my babies love my cooking.
To anybody that believes the FDA is telling us the whole truth & protecting us or belives that all or most pet food are giving us realy good food for our babies go for it. You have your RIGHTS & so do I.
September 5th, 2007 at 2:15 pm
I haven’t read all these posts yet, but the thought occured to me that perhaps a pet food company in competition with Canidae could submit adulterated samples?
I know Canidae has been recommended by folks on this post as being a safe food. What better way to undermine a competitor?
I don’t feed Canidae, don’t know anyone who does, so I have no interest in protecting the company. I just know that the PFI and individual companies are not above ANY dirty tricks!
September 5th, 2007 at 2:31 pm
NO pet food company can be trusted.
NO poster on the internet who says a food is safe can be trusted.
No vet can be trusted, if they sell pet food and did not stand up for the right thing and so far I know of ONE-MrsP has a good vet, the rest are beneath contempt.
The FDA SURE cannot be trusted.
The US government cannot be trusted.
Mainstream media cannot be trusted.
Oprah cannot be trusted.
Trust is DEAD.
September 5th, 2007 at 2:31 pm
E glad your back.
September 5th, 2007 at 4:26 pm
If I were going to release test results I’d do through an unimpeachable second party source. Think people.
September 5th, 2007 at 4:48 pm
The pet food companies are the one who need to worry about the issue of proof !
Does it not SHAME them that all the money spent on TV ads is not working as well as say, TELLING THE TRUTH, paying vet bills and you know, making non lethal pet food?
Pet owners PAID for testing, paid the bills in other words, which is not quite what the pet food companies are doing, is it?
There have been so many Anonymous posters lately, saying that you should not trust things posted on the internet, good advice.
September 5th, 2007 at 5:48 pm
I am so angry over this. That is what I have been feeding my minpins. No more I guess. What are you all feeding your pets. I do some homecooking but I was wondering about Merrick. I have seen that in other reputable dog sites thatthis dog food is considered good. Wasn’t that made my Diamond?
September 5th, 2007 at 6:50 pm
I have switched to Kumpi kibble, but also feed a raw egg in cottage cheese every day. I was feeding Hills Science Diet, and my dogs were fine, but I won’t buy anything from the companies that did silent recalls while other pets are getting sick and dying.
September 5th, 2007 at 6:56 pm
Moosemarcy,
Last time I checked, Canidae dry is made by Pied Piper.
By now, many folks won’t recommend any food. But here’s a place that might be able to help you:
http://www.k9cuisine.com/
Their toll free number is 866/919-2415. Ask for Anthony.
September 5th, 2007 at 9:55 pm
I’m not sure what to believe. There are some strange circumstances surrounding this story and inconsistencies that make me skeptical. Information on another forum is not totally consistent with the info here on Itchmo forums and in both cases, it was a “friend” who posted, not the person who supposedly had the test run. And, a different “friend” at that. It would be more believeable if the person who had the test run would come forward. I hope for those who have dogs that it is not true. Also, although the copy of the test results from Exper-Tox are a little difficult to read, it looks to me that the report date is 8/04/07, which I guess might be a typo. Not important probably - just an observation.
September 6th, 2007 at 12:22 am
nora in your sept. 5 post at 10:44 am want to know what source you took or have the information in your last sentence that says dog tags being found in cans of Merrick dog food a few years ago? I do not use this food any longer due to the loose stools and runny/funny yellowish/whitish color. I’m not bashing this food just want a source of where nora got this information from.
September 6th, 2007 at 5:20 am
“Also in 2006, Merrick Pet Care recalled almost 200,000 cans of “Wingalings†dog food when metal tags were found in some samples”
http://www.api4animals.org/fac.....amp;more=1
September 6th, 2007 at 11:08 am
Now, I am admittedly deeply biased against the pet food companies as my posts to date have certainly shown, however, this whole story is disturbing.
Two different Canidae dog foods (and two different Cal Nat foods) were mixed and sent for testing? Even if one tested positive for something, how could anyone know which of the two mixed foods was responsible? Granted, the mixes were of the same company’s foods, but that is a mistake that no one should make. And now it’s been determined that incorrect dates were listed? So we don’t know which food in the mixture tested positive and now reports of the dates have been changed?
If the person who ordered the tests wants to establish a credible chain of evidence, they need to submit unopened bags of the same food for testing. That would eliminate all questions. Surely there is one unopened bag of each these two Canidae foods somewhere. Epertox can only report on what it is given. With opened, mixed samples, the lab has to take on faith the origin(s) of the sample. Epertox can prove there is acetaminophen in the sample, but is it even Canidae? That’s why the unopened bags are so important. We can’t stop Canidae or any other company until we can prove it really is their food.
Coming on the heels of Menu’s critical financial condition, the testing and documentation of this food needs to be beyond question. Otherwise it looks awkward at best and clouds a critical issue. At worst, it could look like Menu or its ilk is trying to help eliminate the competition and perhaps resurrect its own public reputation some by saying, “See, it wasn’t just us!” (We’ve already seen financial analysts gullible enough to believe that Menu is a victim.) Mixing foods and reporting the wrongs dates/codes muddies things just enough to create panic and a financial backlash. If the test results (after proper testing procedures of unopened bags are followed) are accurate, Canidae deserves those consequences and more. If unopened bags cannot be tested, however, that sets off all kinds of alarms for me.
September 6th, 2007 at 1:15 pm
I checked my bag last night, it is dated June 5. The bag was already in the trash can as I had just filled the storage containers. Just to be extra cautious, I didn’t give it to them. The dates were a little too close for my taste (no pun intended).
I agree that this report is very, very strange. If the person who had it tested told their story directly to Itchmo or any of the other pet moderators I would give it more credit. But coming from a friend or a friend of a friend, details always get messed up. With all the inconsistencies, the questionable packaging/dating of the samples, and the fact that no one is coming forward and explaining why she did things the way she did, I just don’t want to take it as gospel.
I’m strictly feeding Timberwolf dry and Evangers canned until Canidae’s test results come back, and we see how they respond. So far, I think they have had the quickest response. They also didn’t deny that it was their food, they immediately said they were testing the food AND the supplements. So I think they deserve some credit for their response.
I still think it is in the vitamins.
September 6th, 2007 at 7:25 pm
I see some people have offered to help out with the cost of the lab testing. I have an opened bag that I’ve had a problem with and stopped feeding, plus two additional unopened sealed bags that I would really like to get tested. Money is extremely tight right now since my husband recently got laid off. Is there anyone who could help me out with the expense? I am willing to pay for the shipping of the 30 lb bags to ExperTox.
September 7th, 2007 at 11:19 am
Molly, go to the forums here, link is on the top of this page, says forum, go to the section marked pet food info, there is a thread called pet food testing and you can post there, maybe get some help.
If you found your way here , then you can figure out how to use the forum, it is easy.
September 7th, 2007 at 1:10 pm
[…] in a RSS reader.The person who sent in the mixed sample of dog food to Expertox, which was found to have acetaminophen in the sample, emailed us this […]
September 9th, 2007 at 2:26 pm
[…] Expertox, a Texas lab, claimed they found acetaminophen in a mixed dog food sample. The dog owner who sent in the food for testing identified the sample as Canidae dog food on Expertox’s forms. […]
June 8th, 2008 at 3:57 pm
As far as Merrick is concerned, I’m not happy that they found, metal tags in the Wingaling variety, but I have had people I know find worse in their food in what is considered “Fine Dining” Resturants, soapy brillo pad for one! No one is perfect and as long as they are not poisoning my dog, I’ve given them another chance. My Dog is very healthy on their food and people comment on her very shiney, healthy and soft coat. She has much energy and a good disposition. As far as grocery store brands, never! I wish I could get my Cat to eat foods with no preservatives or fillers. I’ve tried many brands to no avail! I even tried giving her homemade food, notta! She likes her fancy feast even if I hate it! She was abandoned when I found her and I wonder if it may be what she was fed before I found her.